You must log in or # to comment.
Tired. Numb.
Ukraine is fucked. Palenstine is fucked. Taiwan is fucked.
Climate is turbo fucked.
And the brain rot heads north
Empathy at what my American friends are going through, and dread about our own incoming conservative wave.
Shocked, saddened here.
I can’t believe Trump did so well. He’ll be the first Republican to win the popular vote since 2004. He’s a racist, sexist, transphobic, fascist, anti-science rapist, convicted felon, climate change-denier, and champion of the uber wealthy.
I guess there are many more deeply racist and sexist people than I wish to believe. It’s BS how first-past-the-post and the electoral college systems work - it’s so very easy to manipulate the system when you know the precious few key areas in advance to try to influence. Control of mainstream news and social media by the billionaire gives dis-, misinformation, and other bias so much reach to undermine democracy and voters’ rational self-interest.
One thing that has helped me the teensiest bit is that even though he got the popular vote, he still got less votes than he did in 2020. It doesn’t help me to know that so many people were blatantly apathetic or misogynistic or whatever we’re blaming the lack of democratic votes on, but at least he got less votes than before.
Is it crazy that he’d be better if he was a five-time ultimate smackdown champion and porn superstar? Camacho actually tried to put the smartest guy on the problem.
I guess there are many more deeply racist and sexist people than I wish to believe.
This. I knew that there was a great deal of racism and misogyny in the USA but the extent of it is horrifying. Having lived almost my whole life there in various states, it still took me by surprise. I dont understand it and never will. Nor do I understand how people can fall for simplistic rhetoric and scapegoating. But clearly it works.
I’m worried this will embolden the bigots of the North and justify some of the terrifying things happening in Prairie politics with anti-trans laws and involuntary placement of homeless people into mental hospitals (AKA the rise of Sanitoriums).
PP and federal conservatives have already expressed anti trans sentiment so I won’t be surprised if it gets introduced into federal politics as well next election. We barely scraped by in BC to avoid the transphobic pos conservative leader this time around. I’m getting ready to fight.
Oh, also both major parties in BC wanted involuntary placement so that’s also well underway here too. Gotta love that :/
I have such a hard time believing that this brain rot is infecting Canada. I do not doubt anything you’ve said is true, it’s still hard to believe.
Numb. Sad. Mostly numb.
I was cheering for Kamala. I wanted the US to succeed. She had the big rallies, the celebrity endorsements, the polls were saying it was neck-and-neck. It looked like sanity was going to prevail. Then Trump just basically sweeps it and it’s like…oh. It’s easy to call the Americans “stupid” or whatever insults I’ve seen flying around the internet, but there was a vote. He won the vote. Over 72 million people think that Trump and the Republican ideology lines up best with their ideology. Who am I to argue with that? I don’t agree with it, but I guess that’s democracy in action. Regardless of what lies were told or what disinformation was spread, people overwhelmingly went out, voted for ol’ Donny, and this is the result. That’s how she goes I guess…? I don’t fucking know anymore dude.
My heart absolutely breaks for the people of Ukraine. I’m sure they’ll lose their US support come January. They don’t deserve that.
I don’t feel as bad as I thought I would. I’ve been an NDP voter all my life, so like most lefties I was shocked by Trump’s win in 2016, horrified by his COVID bullshit, and appalled by his conspiracy theories and violent rhetoric in the 2024 campaign. Trump is so obviously horrible that I kept asking the same question: how could HALF of the US electorate support him? I just can’t believe that HALF of America are fascist misogynistic white supremacists.
So, I started listening to alternative media. For example, I listened to Trump’s interview with Joe Rogan (yes, the whole three+ hours). I listened to Bari Weiss’s Honestly podcast, where she talks to disaffected progressives, and had a great debate between Sam Harris and Ben Shapiro. And many others.
So far, this is what I’ve come up with:
- The Democratic Party has abandoned the traditional working class, or at least the working class feels abandoned by the Democratic Party. The Dems have become “cultural elites” that too many average people just can’t identify with at all. Trump may not be good for the working class, but at least he speaks to them and their concerns. This of course leads to a discussion about how the Dems would have a better relationship with labour if they hadn’t fucked over Bernie Sanders.
- The Democratic Party has become obsessed with identity politics, at the expense of real issues that matter to most people. Identity politics is pure poison that has become the leftist version of McCarthyism to a lot of people.
- The Dems foreign policy is seen as weak by both the left and right. They fucked around on the Ukraine war to the point where Russia is now winning. And they lifted the sanctions on Iran that allowed it to fund Islamist groups like Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Houthis and blow up the Middle East. And the left is pissed off that they don’t speak out against Israel’s aggressive policy toward the Palestinians. So, the Dems aren’t pleasing anyone when it comes to foreign policy.
- The Dems had a good issue with reproductive rights, but a lot of states are moving to protect reproductive rights on theor own (including ballot measures), which may have relieved some of the pressure on Trump.
- People talk a lot about Trump being better for the economy. I’m not sure economists would agree, but that is a large part of the sentiment favouringTrump. Edit: 6. Immigration. How could I forget immigration. Illegal immigration really pisses off Americans, including and perhaps especially among legal immigrants. I’m not sure that immigrants love Trump’s immigration position, but most of the country see the Dems as too ideologically compromised by identity politics to be able to do anything constructive on immigration.
You don’t have to agree with those positions and I don’t plan on defending them. This is just what I’ve picked up in trying to understand why so many people vote for Trump.
There are some important parallels and lessons here for the next Canadian election. Trudeau and the Liberals parallel the cultural elitism of the establishment Democrats. Singh appeals more to the identity politics culture warriors than he does to the working class. This is a big departure from the NDP’s traditional roots in the labour movement. And Poilievre is Trump’s mini-me. So, what can we do in Canada to avoid a repeat of the left’s failure in the US election? Doubling down on identity politics and cultural elitism isn’t going to go well.
I think a lot of people think trump is good for economy for reasons like stripping away environmental regulations. Sure it might make a company cheaper to operate without regulations but often times it is exponentially more expensive to deal with the damages.
That’s way more complex thinking that what people actually do around this. They think he’s good for the econony because he’s rich, or at least plays rich on TV.
CEOs may see him as good for business because rhey believe he’ll make running their businesses cheaper, but the average Trump voter just sees “rich = good with money”, because most people ultimately believe that the world is on some level fair, and if he’s rich it must mean he got there fairly.
Before the EPA the Cuyahoga River was at times more fire than water.
The other thing that I’d add to this is that, post-pandemic, a lot of people have felt the pinch of shifting economic realities. A lot of decisions from years and decades past that have masked the costs neoliberal policies and corporate cost cutting have come home to roost, and it has left people feeli g stressed out and resentful.
They feel their quality of life and standard of living starting to slip, and they see the injustice of the system supporting their bosses, their landlords, and their banks, but not them. And they see who’s currently at the wheel.
Because of this, they also grow increasingly resentful towards discussions of people who need help. They feel like no one is there to help them as the world shifts around them, and yet they have smug culture warriors telling them that they’re worse than Hiitler for not thinking of people they’ll never meet, half a world away.
Trump and Milhouse will not help them, but at least they will not tell them that they are not deserving. And that’s more than what they perceive Democrats, the Liberals, or the NDP doing for them.
Thank you very much for this summary. Sadly I do feel some sort of understanding to a lot of Trump voters that genuinely thought they were making a good decision, and I think your summary reflects why people would feel that way. I 100% disagree with them, but I can understand their frustration and do see a lot of that reflected in Canadian politics as well.
I’m curious about the comment on Singh. As long as I’ve been following/supporting the NDP, I’ve always felt like they were more working class and really haven’t seen a whole lot of identity politics in their expressions. With the exception of maybe racism stuff, but I feel like given Jagmeet’s own (obvious) identity, this would be a central issue to him as a leader and to them as a party. I have seen them express in interviews about concerns for the working class many times otherwise.
You’re doing amazing work here. Not enough people are trying to make an effort to understand far right voters. You don’t have to agree with the policies, but you do still have to make an effort to understand why they appeal to people and makes them want to vote that way.
Liberal parties (Democrats, LPC, etc.) have been ignoring this for far too long and in my opinion, that’s why they keep losing. They lose and blame the voters for not seeing the world the way they do, but they don’t have any understanding or perspective of what the world looks like through the eyes of these voters. That’s why they don’t have any appeal and things are just going to continue getting worse as long as they continue ignoring the real issues that affects voters.
(Unless a real alternative party emerges, I suppose…)
I’m listening to the CBC right now and the prevailing opinion I’m hearing is that the Democrats lost because Biden waited too long to step aside. Talk about learning all the wrong lessons.
Watch how the Liberal narrative will emphasize that. They want Trudeau to step aside, and if (when) they lose to the Cons they’ll say it’s because Trudeau wouldn’t step aside. Or if he does step aside, he didn’t step aside early enough.
Of all the things they learned from this election, it’s how to make excuses when they lose. Somehow, my opinion of the Liberal party continues to sink even lower. I didn’t even think that was possible…
You’re absolutely correct in your conclusions. I’ve been trying to spread the same message and get my close friends to see this situation for what it is, and all I get for my efforts is called a libertarian (which I’m not), or be told I’m racist (I live in a blended family and friends group).
The leftist elitists in the USA love to scoff at the close-minded bigotry from the right, and pat themselves on the back about how open minded they are, while being completely closed off to anyone who tries to tell them how they’re alienating people, and causing strife with their identity politics.
Identity politics are poison. They seem purposefully engineered to sow division, instead of their stated goal of inclusion. I’ve tried to talk about this online a few times and gave up after being eviscerated by people parroting agenda points rather than actually engaging in a conversation.
The left, or the Democrats, or whatever you want to call them, have continually alienated huge portions of the population, portions required to win elections and actually change policies, with issues that affect miniscule portions of the population.
I want everyone to be treated equally. I want equality and inclusion. You don’t obtain that by telling 60% of the people in the country that their voices don’t matter, their opinions don’t matter, and their only job is to shut up and listen. Yes, it’s wise to listen more than you talk when someone who has experienced something you haven’t is sharing their experiences with you. But the overtly hostile fashion in which that message has been spread is offensive, and damaging, and alienating, and we saw the outcome of that last night.
I would warrant caution and nuance when considering the effect of IdPol on these things. It’s a term that’s been abused and bastardized to high heaven, and it’s a concept that the right has made ample, productive (for them) use of.
The politics of whiteness, the politics of masculinity, the politics of white masculinity, the politics of Christian conservatism, the politics of white nationalism, of Christian nationalism, of white-Christian nationalism, etc., are all IdPol. These are identity groups that the right has very successfully leaned on and groomed.
If you actually look at the Democrats, the Liberals, or even the NDP, what Identity Politics do they actually spout? What do they say that’s such a turn off, with respect to IdPol? It’s very little. Instead, what you actually see is them focusing on issues that matter to women, immigrants, and people of colour, but not to the exclusion of others.
But the right has used the fact that they speak of non-white, non-male, non-Christians at all and used it to reinforce the Identity Politics of the blue collar voter.
The aggrivated teenage sitting at the dinner table whining at you about how racist and imperialist the country is is not engaging in IdPol. They’re engaging in the process of coming to terms with the fact that the world is not how it has been portrayed to them. But the rural Canadian or American voting against their interest because the party that is going to fuck them or their community over the most has done the work to sure up their identity as white, rural, and working class.
Their politics and support follows their identity, not their interests or policy preferences.
That is Identity Politics. And you’re right, it’s toxic.
It’s just not what you were using the word to mean.
Great insights!
Yeah, I think a lot of the parallels in Canada is that the failure here is with the NDP, not the Liberals or Conservatives. Overall, those two parties haven’t changed, but at some point - post Layton - the NDP apparently decided to go down that same identity politics road, while similarly abandoning the general working class. Maybe they felt they just weren’t getting enough votes with the latter and there were enough who felt strongly about such social issues, but FFS they could have at least tried harder to support BOTH.
I’m honestly starting to wonder if the reason they’ve continued to support the Liberals is not so much a fear of z Conservative government, but rather if there’s some dirt the Liberals have on NDP leadership to keep them on a leash. Nothing else really explains why they’ve continued down this path of political suicide.
Can’t disagree with anything you said. You’re a hero for watching the Joe Rogan interview, I cannot listen to Trump for more than 5 minutes at a time, it breaks my brain trying to parse what he’s actually saying instead of treating it like some sort of Rorshach test.
I will say he gets the vibes. The US economy is doing pretty well. They’ve done better on inflation than any other OECD country that I’m aware of, their economy is growing, unemployment is low. But… it feels bad. It feels bad for too many people just trying to pay the rent and put food on the table. Is it because too much of that wealth has accrued in the pockets of the wealthy? Maybe, but paying more for a place to live and more for dinner tonight have a visceral reality that talk of housing starts doesn’t.
We’re in a similar position in Canada. I would actually point to the Daycare program as one of the most significant programs that’s helped working class families in years, but I also don’t think it matters really, because I don’t know how well the LPC ahs captured the “vibes” of it.
Not fucking great buddy. Not fucking great.
Pretty terrible, I was hoping Kamala would win
Trump is about to destroy the lives of Americans for narcisstic greed and irrational hatred
about to destroy the lives of Americans for narcisstic greed and irrational hatred
I wouldn’t say that’s true. He’s going to start with that and cement in and spread this globally because of how economically and militarily influential the US is. He will align with crooks, profiteers, and other madmen and grifters, and others aspiring to power will seek to emulate the path. He will guarantee the climate change is not only ignored but buried while it’s effects and consequences exponentially increase in quantity, severity and irreversibility.
Honestly, this will be the reference point for a century or much more of worsening QOL for those who live in democratic republics. Empires of US influence are large ships to turn either way, and Trump’s recoronation shows the rot was deep and permanent. In historic scale US democracy was unprecedented though still short.
Hats off to those in other nations, hope someone can pick up the torch the statue of Liberty dropped.
You know, I work a pretty stressful job, and I think a lot of that stress and anger came from, in some twisted way, a misguided faith of sorts. I did believe that people were, at the very least, capable of making the most sensible decision when given overwhelming evidence of good vs. bad choices; that they intentionally make bad choices either because they weren’t given enough information or were acting intentionally selfish or duplicitous in some way. So whenever I had to deal with someone trying to exploit a loophole or arguing about how they swear they are going to x and such place and will pay at a later time (when you know they won’t do so), it would frustrate me, because I did believe that they were capable of making better choices.
This election is proof that people are just genuinely dumb and hopeless, to a far and large extent. Choosing to omit your own vote, or willingly voting for him, is beyond imagination. We have seen so much of what he has done in the past 8 years now, at minimum. They know what he will likely do in the next 4 years. And they still chose him. Or chose not to participate.
So I’m choosing not to feel angry at people anymore, to not give a shit if they break the rules for whatever reason they justify. Because why be angry at something if you have lost faith in it being better?
This election is proof that people are just genuinely dumb and hopeless
Or that trump really does represent their ideals, and they’re just horrible people.
I was quite put off myself, and was feeling sad for
youthem guys. To all that voted Harris, I’m sorry. To all who didn’t vote, voted 3rd party, or for the orange himself, I am now looking forward to the popcorn party.spoiler
Yes, my name checks out
Honestly terrified for what this will mean for marginalized groups in America. I’m worried that we tend to copy American trends, so what will this mean for our future?
@LittleTarsier @streetfestival
Don’t vote conservative.That goes without saying. Unfortunately, it’s looking like the Conservatives will win here because people are sick of Trudeau and for whatever reason don’t see the NDP as a viable alternative.
Well there is no way they don’t get in next Canadian election.
@Auli
Where we sit today, yes, I agree. But I don’t see Poilievre having the emotional intelligence to deal with Trump. And there is something still dark about his reluctance to get security clearance.
Bracing for impact on Canadian elections.
Upon hearing the news, I felt despondent and a pit in my stomach… I went to do a bit of karaoke and my mood has recovered from that at least.
Clearly political con-artistry is effective. Ford, Smith, Moe, Poilievre and any wannabe dictators of Canada who may emerge in the future, are all taking down notes.
The outcome is not good for Canada and is deeply bad for several issues I care deeply about.
I do hope this drives introspection here about how our working class feels and has been struggling, and that it drives political change before we see a sweeping conservative majority in the next election.
Vile. Disgusting.
I feel so bad for the minority of people there. But the majority apparently, instead of seeing “fuck yeah, Kamala, she could be beacon of democracy and progress in the world” decided “nope, orange man hate people me hate so FUCK YOU OTHER PEOPLE”.
It’s so sad.
Concerning, to say the least.
Consider this.
Trump is…a life-long conartist, a convicted felon, adulterer, rapist, womanizer, misogynist, racist, a twice impeached President, a guy who somehow had nearly a dozen close associates found to be guilty of crimes … Breathes
Someone who “gets along” with some of the most brutal dictators alive like they’re buddies, has been caught on tape describing sexually assaulting women, who has lied over 30,000 times in a span of 4 years, who has made threats against journalists, who has publicly mocked a disabled person, who has publicly shat on veterans, who criticised a POW for getting caught… Breathes
A guy who denied COVID, who promoted unproven treatments while condemning those who wanted to safeguard public health, who rambles incoherently about topics he has little to no grasp on, who thinks everything he does is “perfect” and "nobody has done a “better job”, is in obvious mental decline, has never admitted to being wrong or apologized for anything…
And so on!
Now, would you invite someone like that to dinner? Or have him work in your small business?
Probably not. Nobody would, not even if they were related to such a person.
Why then, would over half the voting public stake the future of their country on giving him a second term as President?
You don’t have to like Harris, or even agree with most of her policies, but she is not a trainwreak of a human being and would most certainly be a better person for the job. Any job.
As a Canadian, to know that a garbage heap of a person like Trump could be freely given excessive power by the voting public only tells me that it could happen in Canada, even if the alternative candidate was 1000x better in every way.
North America, and democracy as a whole, seems doomed. And with rich idiots, podcast morons, and domestic terrorists actively supporting a candidate like that, I worry about the future stability of our global community. And we aren’t even close to being prepared for what malicious use of AI could do during an election.
It takes far more effort and time to build a peaceful, balanced society. And less than four years to completely dismantle that progress.
I have a lot of thoughts on it, mostly unhappy thoughts.
Two things stand out:
First, I’m having a hard time with the voting turnout numbers. More people showed up to boot Trump out of office (voting for Biden), than every before. If you look at the numbers, the Republicans have gone up and up in vote count, albeit, not by a lot. While the Democratic vote count varies wildly year over year. It tells me that if people, specifically democratic voting people, show up, they win. When they don’t, then the GOP wins. It is clear to me that they didn’t show up.
Clearly, more people believed he was a threat to the country in 2020 and turned up in droves to drive him out, but in 2024 when we needed all of those people to turn up again, and keep him out, they just, didn’t bother. I’m sure, a nontrivial amount of the voters flipped between Dem and Rep… Or vice versa… But the total votes when Biden won, were simply a lot more.
So I’m having trouble reconciling that fewer people turned up to vote and keep the orange one out of office, than the number that showed up to kick him out of office to begin with. I don’t understand why they thought they needed to show up in 2020, but felt that they didn’t need to in 2024. I just don’t get it.
The second thing is centered around project 2025. Holy shit that entire plan is cursed. I feel bad for every American that isn’t a straight white male right now. You’re all going to get fucked over in some way, shape, or form. Even if you are a straight white male, you’re probably still fucked because of all the fucked up things that Trump is going to do to the economy that will benefit his billionaire friends (at your expense). You’ll get fucked slightly less than everyone else, but you’ll still get fucked.
The only solace I have in this, is that Trump is done. He cannot run for a third term. Assuming that he isn’t successful in dismantling the democracy at the heart of what the US is, it will only be four years and they can start the very long journey to repairing all the damage that this clown is about to do.
I have no illusions, that even if America survives his second term, they will be fucked for decades to come.
Domestically, they made their bed, they can sleep in it. Yeah, I feel sorry for a lot of Americans, who will certainly suffer but then I also feel sorry for lots of people around the world who are suffering. In the US, they have a democracy, even if flawed and imperfect. At the end of the day, this was the will of the people. Maybe not so much that they wanted Trump (many certainly do) but rather enough people weren’t bothered enough to care.
Unfortunately, this is a central Russian propaganda aim in democracies. Why bother voting? Politicians are all crooks. Mainstream media is all lies. Just give up, don’t engage, just… surrender. Why even try? It’s found fertile ground in an increasingly disillusioned public, and you don’t need to convince everyone to sit out the election, just enough.
Not to stress you out, but have you considered a Trump dynasty? What if Trump endorsed one of his children? This could go on long past this Presidency without even amending the constitution.
I don’t think any of his kids have the charisma to follow in his footsteps.
One thing that I can say Trump does not lack is charisma. I have not seen the same from any of his offspring.
Charisma alone, a good leader does not make; but in this case, I’m pretty sure it’s the only thing Trump has in spades.
