• logicbomb@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      I wouldn’t even try to defend OP, but I once heard someone say that if you have more than four apples, then it is also definitely true that you have four apples.

      • lolcatnip@reddthat.com
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        9 months ago

        That’s true in a very literal sense, but there’s a whole branch of linguistics called pragmatics that’s concerned with things like why it’s usually safe to conclude that when someone says they have four apples, they mean that have only four apples. When there’s any ambiguity I talk like a mathematician and use phrases like “at least four apples” or “exactly four apples”.

          • Nelots@lemm.ee
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            9 months ago

            On the other hand, adding a single world like “only” in there suddenly makes it completely false. Language is fun.

      • humorlessrepost@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        OP treating his statement as a correction requires that he’s not using this interpretation. If he were to use this defense, so could the teacher, so he’d just be changing how he’s wrong, not that he is.

      • gandalf_der_12te@feddit.de
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        9 months ago

        What if there’s a worm in one of them?

        Like, you think you habe more than four apples.

        Then you find out that most of them have worms.

        In the end, you are left with two apples.

        So now, it is not true that you have four apples.

    • Dalvoron@lemm.ee
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      9 months ago

      As a teacher, this type of response is a great jumping off point for the discussion of curriculum vs truth, what is the extent of reality vs what is going to be on the assignment / exam etc.

      It’s also a great way to stick it to the know-it-all who is trying to undermine my credibility, and has the added bonus of perking up the rest of the class.

      • Rodeo
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        9 months ago

        If you can actually have a reasoned discussion about it, instead of simply getting angry at being questioned, then you are better than 90% of teachers.

        In my experience most teachers don’t like being questioned, which of course is directly antithetical to their supposed vocation.

        • Dalvoron@lemm.ee
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          9 months ago

          For me it matters how the question is asked. I love getting questions beyond the scope of the curriculum as it varies up my classes from year to year. However, “Actually there are 4” as in the meme is disrespectful, challenging and undermining. “I heard something about a fourth state of matter, what’s up with that?” is a prompt to reasoned discussion.

          • Rodeo
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            9 months ago

            Sounds like you just don’t want your authority to be challenged.

            If you’re wrong and a student points that out, own it. Instead you expect them to question their own knowledge while submitting to your authority for confirmation or denial. But if the student already knows, they don’t need your confirmation. They need you to admit that you were incorrect, and move forward with the correct information. Otherwise you’re just demonstrating that you’re an authority that cannot be trusted to be fair.

            Authority that cannot be challenged is authority that cannot be respected. Authority must continually earn the respect of its constituents, or it will lose its power over them.

            • Dalvoron@lemm.ee
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              9 months ago

              Oh I’ll admit I’m wrong either way, but yes I do not like my authority to be challenged. It makes the class significantly harder to manage when students feel like it’s OK to dunk on me at any opportunity and provides a bad environment for learning. My preference would be respect, but I will settle for being treated with respect. If a student won’t offer it to me with their questions, then I won’t offer it to them with my response. But I will always admit they are correct (if they are).

              Authority that cannot be challenged is authority that cannot be respected. Authority must continually earn the respect of its constituents, or it will lose its power over them.

              I sort of agree with this. In a classroom, you can challenge me, my knowledge, my abilities. I like to think I earn the respect of my students with all of these, as well as my compassion, my fairness, my humour.

              The reality is that I am an authority however. I wrote the assignments and the exam and I mark them too, and I do it all in accordance with the state-mandated curriculum. If they “know” something because they read about it elsewhere, I should be treated as a equally valid source of information because I am. I know the curriculum inside and out. They dont “need me to admit that I was incorrect, and move forward with the correct information”, they need me to tell them why the thing they “know” is not the thing I’m teaching them. I offer that I was incorrect out of humility, not necessity.