After receiving the text for the ad quoted above, a representative from the advertising team suggested AFSC use the word “war” instead of “genocide” – a word with an entirely different meaning both colloquially and under international law. When AFSC rejected this approach, the New York Times Ad Acceptability Team sent an email that read in part: “Various international bodies, human rights organizations, and governments have differing views on the situation. In line with our commitment to factual accuracy and adherence to legal standards, we must ensure that all advertising content complies with these widely applied definitions.”
My goofy ass thought it meant the oatmeal guys
I don’t think there’s anything “goofy ass” about that. Quaker Oats Company was explicitly named (and used a logo) to cause people to make that mistake.
Which is especially disheartening because Quakers are some of the most truly liberal and loving Christians you can find. The fact that they’re willing to call this a genocide evidence of that, and unsurprising since their interpretation of the bible is 100% strict non-violence to where they can’t legally be drafted into the military due to their beliefs. Some of the most truly leftist Christians you’ll find.
And Quaker Oats has a bit of a spotty history too… https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/spoonful-sugar-helps-radioactive-oatmeal-go-down-180962424/
Some of the most truly leftist Christians you’ll find.
As long as you don’t remember that Nixon was a Quaker.
There are also multiple branches of Quakerism. I greatly appreciate the person above speaking about it because they truly covered the way the Quaker meetings I was raised in are and the kinds of people I have spent so much of my life around.
However, there are other branches that don’t deserve the same praise. There are evangelical Quakers and while they aren’t as bad as what that word usually implies, they also aren’t exactly deserving of the description above. Nixon was born into one of the evangelical Quaker branches.
Source: grew up Quaker. Literally have a minor degree in Quaker studies, lol. (It’s been a while and I’m not active in any meetings or organizations these days, but I’ll always be grateful for the values it instilled in me and the community I found from it.)
There’s a difference between being born into a religion and being a member in good standing.
Nixon cussed and drank and ordered women and children to be murdered en mass.
These are not the ideals of a Quacker.
And funny enough, they’re on the boycott list
It’s not intentionally deceptive, they literally called it that because one of the founders admired the Quakers.
I mean, they wanted to cash in on the positive reputations Quakers had in business. While not being Quaker. And not implementing any of their business practices AFAIK. Plus their logo is of a traditional Puritan and has nothing to do with Quakers.
I think “deceptive” is a fair word.
qualities describing Quakers, such as integrity, honesty, and purity, were traits that he wanted customers to associate with the company’s product
I dunno how else to describe that but intentionally deceptive.
I dunno how else to describe that but intentionally deceptive.
Yeah, it IS part of marketing after all.
That guy killed Gene Hackman and then went after Tom Cruise!
And Jigsaw helped him do it!
Wilford Brimley once upvoted a video parody I made involving him and it made me so happy.
That’s high praise, honestly.
Absolutely agreed.
Diabeetus
It’s the right thing to do.
i knew from the thread title… doesn’t mean i don’t like your idea better.
Lmfao, me too.
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It’s not far right fascist. It is liberal Zionist. Liberals can and have been genocidal too. Liberal Zionism is incompatible with humanism or universal values.
you two are in agreement on everything except for what constitutes “far right”
personally, i think any public traded or billionaire owned media outlet is intrinsically far right, but i can also understand drawing the distinctions along the lines of how things compare based on their reach. comparing NYT to bellingcat can’t be fair because NYT can reach more eyes.
so basically, the distinction between you two is not who’s wrong, it’s about how you categorize who’s wrong
The US definition of liberal doesn’t have much to do with actual freedom / liberalism, it’s mostly conservatives that want free trade
The values a newspaper represent and in which political direction they lean do not have to be the same just because they’re owned by wealthy people or publicly traded.
I also wouldn’t classify any big corporation categorically far right just because they are big. Calling something far right/extremist just because you are not a fan of it doesn’t change what constitutes reality. This take is completely unhinged. What exactly is intrinsic about the political leaning?
USA Liberal ≡ Far Right Zionist ≡ Fascist
Imagine a carriage return in the middle there
You can call the NYT a bunch of things but I’d argue its hardly far right fascist propaganda.
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AFSC is the American Friends Service Committee.
So, a little to unpack here. “Quaker” is the common name for what is more formally known as The Religious Society of Friends. Thus American Friends Service Committee.
Yes, the same Quakers from our history books. Actually to this day genuinely quality people and one of the few Christian groups I tend to have a decent amount of respect for.
I don’t know if I got memory holed or what, but I have a distinct memory during the Iraq War of a group of Quakers in kayaks blockading some US warships from leaving port to go to war and that was the pretense that Bush wanted to use to charge these non-violent Quaker anti-war protestors with terrorism charges. It’s been a while and I’ve not been able to dig up a link but I swear it happened, I can find ACLU documents mentioning the Bush admin targeting Quakers, but that’s about it. Interestingly enough, it included surveillance of this exact organization.
https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/aclu-report-shows-widespread-pentagon-surveillance-peace-activists (January 2007)
In response to the ACLU’s FOIA requests filed on February 1, 2006, the Defense Department has released dozens of TALON reports that were compiled on Americans. Many of the reports focus on anti-military recruitment events and protests, including activities organized by the Quaker organization American Friends Service Committee, United for Peace and Justice, Veterans for Peace, and Catholic Worker.
It’s making me really happy seeing how many people in the comments here have nice things to say about Quakers!
I don’t remember the incident you’re recalling. Sounds like something my people would do though, lol. What I do think of in terms of Quaker activity at the time is a lot of protests and also Tom Fox, a Quaker taken hostage and killed in Iraq. He was there representing the org Christian Peacemaker Team, which goes to places plagued with violence to do service and good. Unlike missionaries and despite their name, they do not try to convert anyone.
I did not know Tom, but I know many people who did. And despite the very personal loss, the response was doubling down on the efforts to bring peace and stop the war. I think it was a pretty widespread assumption that most Friends organizations were on watch lists.
Leftist Quakers are pretty radical, and pretty awesome.
American Friends Service Committee
“The One Where Ross Drops White Phosphorus on Civilians”
Genocide is just too strong of a word. They are just disagreeing by murdering all their population. You see, it is just a disagreement.
Genocide is only genocide if it comes from the genocide region of france. Otherwise it’s just a sparkling massacre.
Wow, that was a good one!
1% of Gaza is dead.
“Murdering all their population.”
Grow up.
The definition of genocide explicitly does not require a given percentage of a population.
In whole OR IN PART.
That already exceeds the Bosnian genocide by more than 10,000 people.
Yes and in the Bosnian genocide there were not credible claims that the deceased were incidental casualties, which are permissive and expected in war. There were soldiers going door to door murdering families, lining them up and shooting them, sometimes hundreds at a time. You know, actual genocide.
Nothing like that has happened in Gaza, not even allegedly. There’s been some mistakes and some definite war crimes. That’s all war, though.
If you are going to make a statement counter to the UN, Amnesty International, and the governments of Ireland and South Africa (among other institutions that I’m too lazy to link below) you’re going to need more of a citation than “trust me bro.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/07/world/europe/ireland-icj-israel-genocide.html
Just look at all the leaders and western institutions that say otherwise. Probably your own country’s intelligence and diplomatic heads, probably your chief executive. The list of institutions that agree with me is much longer than your list of loudmouths. The question you should ask is when did South Africa and Ireland start working for Iran?
Ah, so trust me bro. Good day!
Hmm, but if they are larger in number, it doesn’t necessarily mean they are right. Right? 🤔 Or am I misunderstanding your point?
Of course number doesn’t make something right or wrong.
I also find persuasive the list of The country’s in support of South Africa’s complaint to the ICC; a bunch of religious dictatorships and monarchies with their own abysmal human rights records, compared to those who supported Israel, which includes like France, Australia, Japan, and even Canada. Canada is widely known for its cool head in international affairs and it’s consistent stance where human rights are concerned, which might not be as aggressive as some wish, but they manage to maintain relations and push their agenda, which is usually shared by the western world, forward.
Nothing like that has happened, except for all the times IDF soldiers have admitted to doing it, and all the times the leadership had admitted to allowing or encouraging it
There’s just a minority pushing back openly
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No not at all. Israel actually prosecutes war criminals and will continue to do so. That’s unlike Gaza, where war crimes are rewarded with cash prizes, paid in Iranian Dinar.
That’s the leadership the world expects from Hamas; let everyone starve so they can build out tunnels and buy rocket launchers, get 50,000 people killed as voluntary and involuntary human shields, and then sit back and let Qatari and other anti-western media brainwash well-meaning folks such as you into thinking everyone in Gaza is getting killed, when it’s really just a very small amount of people who just can’t manage to stay away from Hamas like the other 99%.
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