• starman2112@sh.itjust.works
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    23 days ago

    70% of the market. Half of those computers can’t even run windows 11. Good to see Microsoft taking charge in the fight against the environment by asking tens of millions of people to throw away their perfectly good computers and buy new ones

    • JackbyDev@programming.dev
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      23 days ago

      For real. I’m genuinely trying to grasp why. Is it seriously just so they can require secure boot and then say Windows 11 is secure from ransomware even though that’s a feature of the motherboard and not the OS?

      • BCsven
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        23 days ago

        They have added so much ad stuff and other garbage that the OS is slowing down, to combat the user perception that the OS is slow they have increased the hardware requirement.

      • chiliedogg@lemmy.world
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        23 days ago

        The home-user PC market has been hit HARD by smartphones and tablets. Suburban families no longer have a desktop in a home office plus a laptop for each member of the family. They may have a laptop, and it’s probably a Mac.

        This decision is too make people buy new devices or upgrade to an OS that has a lot more tracking built in.

        Microsoft is pressing AI and other data-scraping tech hard, but they’re necessarily going to have to have enterprise and government licenses that allow admins to block those features for legal and security reasons.

        So they desperately need new home users they can data-mine.

        • ReallyZen@lemmy.ml
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          23 days ago

          I see I sideload of Gentleman Agreement with the hardware vendors here:

          • Hardware Vendors : “Oh No, The Market is Slowing Down!”
          • Microsoft: “Hold My Beer, it’s Payback Time”

          Everyone wins. Well, the usual suspects win as usual. The environment and the customer can go kiss Mr Gates and Mr Dell’s asses.

  • Bongles@lemm.ee
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    23 days ago

    So…

    Windows 10: the “last” windows version

    Release Windows 11, requires specific hardware that you can’t realistically add to your existing PC. But Windows 10 will keep being updated

    Windows 10 is not getting anymore updates

    Love it, no notes.

    • drislands@lemmy.world
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      23 days ago

      To be fair, my understanding is the “10 is the last version” idea came from a developer speaking in an unofficial capacity and the media ran with it. It may have never been true.

      • jj4211@lemmy.world
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        23 days ago

        While that is technically true, Microsoft didn’t really make any effort to correct the misunderstanding, despite it being a widely reported story in tech.

        I suspect they had a legitimate faction that was going to say “rolling release” and so they let it go.

      • JackbyDev@programming.dev
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        23 days ago

        It was definitely an official capacity because it was a Microsoft conference, but his phrasing was more like “latest” even though he said last. I think they misspoke.

      • ඞmir@lemmy.ml
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        22 days ago

        You can use a win10 key for win11 and vice versa, so you could just see it as an update if it wasn’t for the tpm requirement

  • HouseWolf@lemm.ee
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    24 days ago

    Windows 10 LTSC 2021 edition has support until January 13th 2032.

    I’d obviously prefer if more people gave Linux a try but if you’re literally forced to use Windows then it’s probably your best option right now.

    • Switorik@lemmy.zip
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      24 days ago

      If my Nvidia graphics card played nicely, I would.

      It’s my #1 complaint with Linux… Well Nvidia.

      • miss phant@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        24 days ago

        Progress in that regard is actually pretty rampant lately, I can imagine by the time Windows 10 is EOL it will be no different from AMD.

            • Switorik@lemmy.zip
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              20 days ago

              Well now you have me wanting to try it again.

              The main issue I’ve been having is getting two monitors to work.

              Install Linux, one monitor works. Let’s try changing the driver, permanent black screen.

              Reinstall Linux, well maybe I can make one monitor work. Nope. Let’s try and change the driver using the terminal. Oh black screen again.

              Ok I’ll only use Linux for coding on one monitor, Windows update somehow lost the boot loader for Linux. I’m not good on grub so I just removed Linux afterwards.

              I have another older computer, still Nvidia. Let’s do a clean install. No windows, just Linux. Configure proton on steam, hmm it doesn’t launch games. It just says starting then nothing. No errors. Let’s try different compatibilities, still no errors.

              What I experienced is, Linux doesn’t tell you what You’re doing wrong, it just doesn’t work. Which isn’t going to work for the majority of computer users.

              If something is having an issue, I want to know why, which unfortunately and fortunately Windows does a good job on.

              • Petter1@lemm.ee
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                20 days ago

                I found the best working linux for me is endeavorOS, which istalls Arch and package manager yay If you want to install anything just write yay „anything“ and choose what to install from the list (google „aur „answer to anything“ „ to check which answer is the app you want) For installing proprietary NVIDIA drivers, there is a tool preinstalled (have to google the name) if you really want.

                • Switorik@lemmy.zip
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                  20 days ago

                  I’ll try endeavor next time.

                  If I can get overwatch and steam games to work, I would leave Windows in a heart beat. But I’m also at the point in my life where I can’t spend hours troubleshooting.

      • BReel@lemmy.one
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        20 days ago

        Not sure what you have, what your trying to do, and am pretty new to Linux myself, but I’m running KDE neon with a 3070, and after a little work to get drivers updated I’ve had minimal issues!

        I’m not doing anything too crazy though, mostly web browsing and gaming is all.

      • HouseWolf@lemm.ee
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        23 days ago

        What card you using? I have a RTX 3080 and it’s worked fine on Endeavour/KDE (besides Wayland)

  • Matriks404@lemmy.world
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    23 days ago

    I like how they end support for OS without providing an upgrade for a lot of people. Might as well put a Linux ad in their “Your PC is not supported” bullshit.

    • ArtificialLink@lemy.lol
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      23 days ago

      My laptop which is still perfectly usable doesn’t have support for 11. Im probably gonna switch to mint or popos but I know lots of ppl that dont have new laptops and they just fucked? And there are tons of end users that just have no desire to learn some of the intricacies of linux even if it is something mostly simple like mint. They’re gonna have to support security updates when they see the adoption numbers. Just like they had to do with 7 till they basically got to 10.

      • Demdaru@lemmy.world
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        22 days ago

        Now now, let’s keep honest here. They did provide option to install Win 11 on unsupported hardware. It’s just slightly hidden, prolly to avoid people bricking their pc’s an blaming MS. And also it won’t update.

  • eletes@sh.itjust.works
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    23 days ago

    All these gaming anti-cheats better become Linux compatible cause I’m definitely not upgrading to 11

    • nexussapphire@lemm.ee
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      23 days ago

      Anti cheat is about the only thing that doesn’t work but I see that as a bonus. Anti cheat is more like a virus than it ever has been with the rootkit thing.

    • ILikeBoobies
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      23 days ago

      If enough people switch then they’ll be forced to support it

      Unfortunately users tend to have a “once they support a platform I’m not on then I’ll swap” mentality

    • GoodEye8@lemm.ee
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      22 days ago

      EAC and Battleye both can work with Proton, the developers just need to set it up. Those two cover most of the gaming anticheat market. Battleye should be as simple as the dev telling Battleye to turn on Proton support and EAC should be an SDK upgrade.

      It’s all relatively easy to support Linux, people just need to pressure developers to make it happen.

  • Dizzy Devil Ducky@lemm.ee
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    24 days ago

    All jokes aside, after hearing that EOL is coming to Win10 this October, I have decided over the summer, before fall quarter is in and I’m back to start my 2nd year of college, that I would definitely be taking everything I need/want off of my desktop and switch to something like mint or MX because of how simple and user friendly they’ve been to me as someone who’s only been using Linux for maybe 2-3 years. Only things I would I need are dedicated time and personal drive to pull that off and a new external drive for storing all my files.

      • FIST_FILLET@lemmy.ml
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        23 days ago

        i know you guys are probably right when you say that security updates are important, but why exactly? give me an example of how i could be fucked over while i’m just mindlessly playing my steam games and watching twitch+youtube on a system that hasn’t been updated since 2016.

        i blindly assume that as long as i don’t download and run stupid .exes or click stupid links, i am completely fine

        • Opisek@lemmy.world
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          23 days ago

          You don’t need to click anything suspicious. Remote code execution has in the past been done through images, PDFs, comments on some webpage, or supposedly trustworthy games. Just recently, Minecraft would let an attacker run anything on the victim’s computer due to a vulnerability in Log4j.

          If your computer is not directly exposed to the internet, you might get away with some security updates that for example fix vulnerabilities that target the system firewall. But the point is, you’re constantly exposing yourself to attackers without knowing so.

          A few example vectors:

          • Cross-Site Scripting (XSS) allows an attacker to run arbitrary code on the victim’s browser. All that’s required is a website that doesn’t validate its input properly. That is, an attacker can write executable code into a YouTube comment and when you view that comment, your computer will execute that code. Obviously YouTube is secured against that, but there are plenty of websites where this attack can be done. Therefore, modern browsers isolate the code execution to only that “browser tab”, so the attacker can’t access some sensitive data (unless the browser has some undiscovered vulnerability or for example the page itself contains sensitive information, say your bank account details). While modern browsers should provide sufficient protection against such attacks, the take-away point is that you don’t necessarily need to click any “suspicious links”. A vulnerability in a well-known website you frequent could be discovered any day.

          • An attacker can easily make your PC go to their website when typing google.com. DNS (how your computer is able to tell which web address is which computer) is not encrypted. It is incredibly easy tamper with. Why you don’t get scammed everyday is because of TLS encryption. Your computer is able to tell that the website is not Google, because it doesn’t have Google’s cryptographic “keys”. Assume that we discover a vulnerability in TLS (encryption of webpages) tomorrow and you refuse to update your operating system. Suddenly, an attacker can route any traffic they’d like back to them and you would be none the wiser. Same thing would happen if some vulnerability is discovered in X509 certificates, if ICANN’s private keys are leaked, and so on.

          There are a lot of things that could go wrong. And they go wrong daily. Security updates fix vulnerabilities that we constantly find. They may be updates for your browser, your games, or indeed your operating system, depending on where that vulnerability is. The examples I gave are exaggerated, because they’re meant to be simple to understand. We do not find vulnerabilities in TLS every single day. Still, weak points are being discovered and fixed constantly. One of the bigger exploits were Spectre/Meltdown (attacks on the CPU) that let an attacker read any data they want, provided they can simply run some code on your computer in some way.

          Also, obviously, if you expose yourself to the internet directly (e.g. port forwarding) or connect to an unsecure WiFi network, you’ll be bombarded with automated attacks that exploit holes found in firewall and the likes. If you open a port on your computer right now, you’ll get around a few hundred such knocks per day.

          There are plenty of videos online that display what happens if you for example use a Windows 95 computer, either directly exposed to the internet or not. Might be worth watching to see just how easy it is for attackers to take over in the case of such an ancient system. Same principles apply to newer systems as well, the attacks are just more complex.

          • FIST_FILLET@lemmy.ml
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            23 days ago

            thank you for the explanation and the examples :) i will no longer be so ignorant about security updates

      • Richard@lemmy.world
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        23 days ago

        For web browsing, that almost makes no difference. As long as the browser is being updated, the most important attack vectors are closed. Even if there are any exploitable vulnerabilities on the OS, that will stop malware from even getting to them.

        • Opisek@lemmy.world
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          23 days ago

          Absolute joke of a comment. You are assuming the browser is a holy grail completely isolating the internet from the operating system.

          First of all. The browser runs on the operating system’s services. In particular, the isolation that you implicitly cite is done entirely by the kernel. (That’s for example why you cannot run chrome in an unprivileged docker container - the crucial isolation-centered system calls are not available) The whole network stack is managed by the operating system. Cryptography can also partially be done OS-sided. The simplest example is CSPRNG, which is usually provided by the OS. (Advanced systems may rely on external physical generators, see Cloudflare’s lava lamps).

          Secondly. Completely and utterly wrong. The linked video displays the execution of Meltdown/Spectre within a browser. Using JavaScript. This allows the attacker to gain access to any data they want on your computer simply by running some JavaScript code. Easily remotely executed via XSS on a poorly written website. You may read the full article here. Or inform yourself about Meltdown and Spectre here. How is that relevant? Combating this vulnerability was primarily done via critical OS updates. The exploits are inherit to certain CPUs and are therefore not fully fixable. Still, the combination of BIOS, Chipset, OS, and browser updates help prevent very serious attack vectors. (That’s the reason why the browser’s time measurement is only accurate to about the millisecond.)

          So no. Browsers aren’t the magic solution to everything (sorry Ubuntu Snap). They very much depend on the OS providing the assumed security guarantees. And even assuming no direct vulnerabilities in the OS, we can never exclude side-channel attacks, like what Meltdown and Spectre were (or still are if you refuse to update your system).