• yenahmik@lemmy.world
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    6 months ago

    Imagine having to get a judge to signoff on any other medical procedure, and it really highlights the absurdity.

    …this feels a lot like the death panels a certain sect was screeching about back in 2008/2009

    • someguy3
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      6 months ago

      Frame Canada: Wendell Potter spent decades scaring Americans. About Canada. He worked for the health insurance industry, and he knew that if Americans understood Canadian-style health care, they might… like it. So he helped deploy an industry playbook for protecting the health insurance agency. https://www.npr.org/2020/10/19/925354134/frame-canada

        • girlfreddy@sh.itjust.works
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          6 months ago

          Ontario’s Health Care Consent Act has been on the books for nearly two decades. Like similar laws in many Canadian provinces—and American states—it sets out the process for making treatment decisions when a patient cannot provide or withhold her consent—when she is in a coma and on life support, for example.

          America has them too. The above is from the same Slate article you linked.

          Maybe don’t just pick and choose portions of an article that match your confirmation bias.

          • Buelldozer@lemmy.today
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            6 months ago

            America has them too.

            I never said they didn’t but I will point that America’s version pretty much just assigns guardianship and decision making authority to one guardian or another in the case of a dispute. The Ontario version can actually TAKE guardianship from someone and make decisions about care on their own authority.

            Regardless of how it works in America the point stands. Canada’s “Death Panels” were not a fabrication. The “Consent and Capacity Board” of Ontario exists.

            • FabioTheNewOrder@lemmy.world
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              6 months ago

              I’d much prefer a panel if doctors deciding my fate rather than my mother or my father who may be blinded by their own emotions.

              Even more if my family members were part of a sect like the Jehovah’s witnesses, for whom not even blood transfusions are acceptable. How stupid do you have to be to leave a loved one to die just to follow the instructions given by illiterate people living 2000 years ago? This kind of decisions should be informed but should also have limits around them. Keeping religion outside if this realm should be a very clear one for instance

        • someguy3
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          6 months ago

          Wow at the gymnastics and hoop jumping of that article to try to apply a term that does not match the common fear mongering use of the word or even the situation. Classic clickbait headline.

          You should listen to the podcast.

          • Buelldozer@lemmy.today
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            6 months ago

            Wow at the gymnastics and hoop jumping of that article to try to apply a term that does not match the common fear mongering use of the word or even the situation.

            Care to point out the “gymnastics and hoop jumping” in the article? Canada does in fact have Governmental bodies that can and will over ride the wishes of close family and / or guardians even when doing so will mean someone’s death. In Ontario that body is called the " Consent and Capacity Board.". That isn’t “fear mongering” it’s fact and it definitely matches up with the commonly used idea behind the idiom “Death Panel”.

            I don’t need to listen to a 24 minute podcast to learn something that the government of Ontario has already openly talked about.

            • someguy3
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              6 months ago

              Lol you want people to read your links while you ignore other people’s links. LOLOLOLOLOLOL. The very definition of living in a self chosen echo chamber of clickbait headlines.

      • yenahmik@lemmy.world
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        6 months ago

        Ehh…I think that’s a little different in that they needed a judge to determine who had the right to make medical decisions for her. The judge themselves weren’t making the call for what should be done, only if it was her husband or parents who had the right to make medical decisions.

        This is more along the lines of my appendix is on the verge of bursting. I want it removed. My doctor recommends removal and is willing and able to do so. The govt says I don’t think it’s bad enough yet and if you do it now I will criminally charge you. Wait until it explodes and you are at risk for sepsis before I will allow you to undergo surgery, despite the fact I have zero medical experience.

    • Maggoty@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      Related, could you imagine having to ask a private, for profit, organization for permission? The same organization that would have to pay money out?

      Good thing we avoided those death panels.

    • BolexForSoup@kbin.social
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      6 months ago

      That death panel thing was so fucking stupid. And when it proved to be nonsense, everyone just pretended they weren’t yelling about it constantly.

      • 520@kbin.social
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        6 months ago

        Oh it’s anything but nonsense. They exist today, in health insurers when deciding whether or not to pay out.

      • sadreality@kbin.social
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        6 months ago

        How did they get proved nonsense don’t we have health insurance companies staffed by clowns doing the “death panel” jobs?

        • BolexForSoup@kbin.social
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          6 months ago

          That’s literally what we’ve had for decades. The ACA did not invent it and it’s not quite the same as what was being claimed by the right during the late 2000’s/2010’s.

          • sadreality@kbin.social
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            6 months ago

            Exactly, the death panels have always been around.

            Mouth breezer boomers have no issue with private company doing the job though since teevee said that was “ok”

    • sadreality@kbin.social
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      6 months ago

      FEMA Camps staffed by Obama death panels is the proper solution to the elder problem we are facing.

        • Hyperreality@kbin.social
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          6 months ago

          It’s a bit like gas stoves. I was reading about gas stoves being popular in the US and apparently right wing media like fox news and the like have been going on about induction stoves being communist and Biden coming to get your gas stove. Here’s a perfectly sane member of congress tweeting about it:

          “I’ll NEVER give up my gas stove. If the maniacs in the White House come for my stove, they can pry it from my cold dead hands. COME AND TAKE IT!!”

          https://twitter.com/RonnyJacksonTX/status/1612839703018934274?t=ptxUxaAhqE1ax8FwY15cyA

          Apparently they’re trying or tried to make that part of the culture war.

          Thing is, I don’t live in the US. So at my local ikea, gas stoves were in the bargain corner at something like 70% off. Can’t seem to get rid of the things, because most people now realise induction is safer, often better, fast, and that gas stoves emit harmful levels of stuff like benzene and NO2.

  • Birdie@thelemmy.club
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    6 months ago

    Texas judge grants permission for woman to access healthcare.

    That’s what really happened.

    • NOT_RICK@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      Getting the government to sign your permission slip before being allowed necessary medical care

      Just small government things

      • IanSomnia@lemmy.world
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        6 months ago

        Yes, being specific is more specific. I assume you’re implying that more specific = better. The point of the comenter you replied to is that the specifics of the type of healthcare they are receiving is unnecessary. You shouldn’t need a judge to give your doctor permission to provide you with healthcare. It doesn’t matter what kind it is.

        • chitak166@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          the specifics of the type of healthcare they are receiving is unnecessary.

          To you, maybe. But you don’t get to deem what’s necessary for everyone else.

          You’re arguing in bad faith when you try to hide your stance behind vagueness. Both sides do it, and I never take either of you seriously when you do.

          • IanSomnia@lemmy.world
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            6 months ago

            Hide our stance? The original commenter summarized the article in a way that made their stance clear. They believe the procedure in the article is medical care. They don’t have to state what procedure they’re talking about because it’s in the article.

            Your accusation that they’re trying to hide what the procedure is leads me to believe you don’t agree that it is healthcare. So in the interest of having a productive discussion about the topic of this article I will make an argument and ask you what you think.

            1. What is considered healthcare should be decided by medical professional consensus.

            2. Your access to healthcare should not be dependent on a judges approval.

            3. The procedure we are discussing detailed in the article is considered healthcare by medical professional consensus.

            Conclusion. Access to the procedure we are discussing detailed in the article should not be dependent on a judges approval.

            What do you think?

            • chitak166@lemmy.world
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              6 months ago

              I think you assumed an argument that is not mine and then proceeded to argue against it as though you were arguing against me.

              I was very clear from the beginning, and my position has not changed nor have you invalidated it.

  • Melllvar@startrek.website
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    6 months ago

    “There are no facts pled which demonstrate that Ms. Cox is at any more of a risk, let alone life-threatening, than the countless women who give birth every day with similar medical histories,” the state wrote

    Wow. They really don’t get it, do they?

    • Billiam@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      “We’re being just as cruel to her as every other woman in Texas; why should she get special treatment!?”

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      6 months ago

      Of course they don’t. They’re men. If THEY were the ones who could get pregnant, you bet your damn life that there’d be “Get Your Free Abortion Here” clinics on every corner of every street in every city around the globe.

  • deadtom@lemmy.world
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    6 months ago

    Were this my wife and this bullshit caused her to die the only viable path I could see is personally watching myself squeeze the life out of every single one of these morally bankrupt shit stains. Such utter trash. I don’t know why we haven’t exiled these cultists from civil society.

  • Nougat@kbin.social
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    6 months ago

    That decision is likely to be appealed by the state, which argued that Cox does not meet the criteria for a medical exception.

    Great, hold it up in the appeals courts to get the stupid outcome you want regardless of whether you win the appeal, the State. This is the definition of abusing the judicial system.

    • someguy3
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      6 months ago

      Oh everything took too long and now you can’t get an abortion? Tee hee.

  • Birdie@thelemmy.club
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    6 months ago

    I mean, it’s in the article. This pregnancy, which will not survive, has a significant chance of destroying any chance that she can ever carry another pregnancy if allowed to come to term.

    To preserve her ability to carry another healthy pregnancy to term, this one must be terminated.

    Doctors do things every day to prevent serious harm later and this should not be a situation that demands a woman and her doctor to freaking BEG a judge for permission to be able to follow the medical recommendation.

    • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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      6 months ago

      It’s Texas, they literally don’t care about this poor woman and the crap situation their philosophy has put her in, in fact they don’t even really care about the baby, despite their claims to the country, they just like having power to impose their oppressive worldview on everyone else. They couldn’t give a flying rat about the consequences.

  • IamSparticles@lemmy.zip
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    6 months ago

    “The idea that Ms. Cox wants so desperately to be a parent and this law may have her lose that ability is shocking and would be a genuine miscarriage of justice,” Gamble said.

    I can’t decide if that’s a clever choice of words, or a really poor choice of words.

  • 👁️👄👁️@lemm.ee
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    6 months ago

    Can I go to court and get their permission to jerk off since it’s killing a couple trillion babies?

    • eltrain123@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      Don’t ask if you don’t want the answer.

      They will tell you it’s a sin to jerk off and will probably try to pass legislation making that illegal, too.

      Just rub one out and move on…

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    6 months ago

    Oh isn’t that the pinnacle of christian goodness for his highness the judge to dismount from his high manly horse long enough to grant a lowly peasant commoner, and a WOMAN no less, the right to get the healthcare she requires. Let’s all bow down and kiss his royal purple ass in thanks. Thank you, conservative men, for ensuring that all women and girls no longer have to be burdened by independence and self care. What a noble gesture.

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        6 months ago

        That’s very different. (looks into the camera). Never mind! I now know that to be the case, it was reported on the news last night. Sorry for my flying off the handle. I just assumed the judge was male - is that some kind of reverse chauvinism?

  • Pratai
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    6 months ago

    So, tomorrow we should be seeing tons of articles about all the death threats he’s receiving from the cowardly conservatives then?

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      6 months ago

      No need, the TX supreme Court just issued a temporary injunction blocking this decision pending scrutiny. Subjecting medical decisions to the court system is what Texas does because they love freedom and small government.

    • ⓝⓞ🅞🅝🅔
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      6 months ago

      What the… Erm…

      I love Boost. And Sync is great.

      How that happened is beyond me. 😳