Everyone loves a comeback story.
Can a 20 year old overlooked technology make a comeback as a completely decentralized, free, and scalable technology for the growing masses of people who value freedom and privacy?
I wish I could like XMPP, I really do, but no client I have used has a block function properly implemented, as in, you can’t unblock people you have blocked, and I tested it with a friend a few weeks ago and found that clients that don’t properly implement a block function (as in, not even letting you block anyone) can easily message someone who has blocked them from another client. This is an immediate No for a chat protocol in my opinion
I’m with 'ya - I was fully in to the XMPP ecosystem a few years ago and found the clients so incredibly frustrating (for a variety of feature implementation issues) that I had to dump it. XMPP isn’t for families, and from what you’re saying, not good for personal safety either.
Give it a try again, lots of things have improved with XMPP clients in recent years.
Blocking also usually works, but the default way of dealing with unwanted communication in XMPP is to not approve contacts in the first place. Of course there can always be cases where that might not be feasible and where blocking also fails.
I’ve more than my fill of XMPP experience since it was Jabber. Pretty completely done with it at this point - and my most recent experiences were still not great, and they’re within the past couple of years. My standpoint isn’t just from a user level, as well. Have run a few XMPP servers over the years.
Element, on the other hand, has really become an excellent client.
Personally I don’t think blocking is that important, because most of the time problems can be resolved in another way, like ignoring the messages. However, it can be necessary in extreme cases, and in fact it is already implemented in XMPP at the server level, as I understand. So there are probably many clients that support blocking whichever JID’s you desire. I myself have used the blocking feature in the past.
Well it just depends on your mental fortitude. Harassers always stop when they don’t get a response, because your response is necessary for them to continue. Getting the messages at all can be upsetting, but the power is in your hands to delete them and not let it get to you.
No, harassers don’t always stop - this is a very simplistic view of things. Just ‘buck up’ and all will be well, eh? Have I misinterpreted your comments, or do you also believe that people who are on employment insurance are just lazy?
For me, blocking is one of the most important features any social app (chats, social media, etc) should have. I tried using Jabber to block my friend and had them message me from Xabber (from which I was entirely unable to block anyone), and their messages came through just fine. Months before that test, I had tried to test blocking someone else, but was unable to unblock them, even though all my clients said they weren’t blocked. I simply remained unable to message them, and the client kept telling me I had blocked their JID.
Could this have been an issue with the server I was using?
It’s possible that the implementation leaves something to be desired. Because I have used this feature so little myself, I will have to investigate to see what is truly going on and know how the server handles it vs. how the client handles it. I am currently using Converations on my phone with a Disroot account, and I have someone blocked. When I go into “Account details” I can open “Show block list” in the drop-down menu and they are still there. (As they should be, lol.) I can hold down on it and elect to unblock them. My understanding is that the server keeps this list and doesn’t allow messages directly from that JID to even be delivered to my client. I can also imagine some clients not being aware of this at all.
Even though I blocked their JID, it’s possible we both can be in the same MUC and I get messages from them through the MUC itself. I’m not sure if it’s possible to block that without help from the MUC’s admin.
Edit: One caveat here is that if you block individual JID’s, someone could create more JID’s with which to message you. Some XMPP servers have this behavior whereby they silently delete all incoming messages from people you haven’t added to your roster, so this “add-first” policy helps them keep out spam. Ideally you would be able to contact your server admin in cases of abuse if it would become necessary to block problematic servers or warn the admins of said servers of abuse.
Even though I blocked their JID, it’s possible we both can be in the same MUC and I get messages from them through the MUC itself. I’m not sure if it’s possible to block that without help from the MUC’s admin.
Yes that is not possible as only MUC admins actually know the real user JID (privacy feature), so a client can not know that the person in the MUC with the pseudonymous nick “marmulak” is the same user as the “[email protected]” on your block-list.
I wish I could like XMPP, I really do, but no client I have used has a block function properly implemented, as in, you can’t unblock people you have blocked, and I tested it with a friend a few weeks ago and found that clients that don’t properly implement a block function (as in, not even letting you block anyone) can easily message someone who has blocked them from another client. This is an immediate No for a chat protocol in my opinion
I’m with 'ya - I was fully in to the XMPP ecosystem a few years ago and found the clients so incredibly frustrating (for a variety of feature implementation issues) that I had to dump it. XMPP isn’t for families, and from what you’re saying, not good for personal safety either.
Give it a try again, lots of things have improved with XMPP clients in recent years.
Blocking also usually works, but the default way of dealing with unwanted communication in XMPP is to not approve contacts in the first place. Of course there can always be cases where that might not be feasible and where blocking also fails.
I’ve more than my fill of XMPP experience since it was Jabber. Pretty completely done with it at this point - and my most recent experiences were still not great, and they’re within the past couple of years. My standpoint isn’t just from a user level, as well. Have run a few XMPP servers over the years.
Element, on the other hand, has really become an excellent client.
Personally I don’t think blocking is that important, because most of the time problems can be resolved in another way, like ignoring the messages. However, it can be necessary in extreme cases, and in fact it is already implemented in XMPP at the server level, as I understand. So there are probably many clients that support blocking whichever JID’s you desire. I myself have used the blocking feature in the past.
Blocking is extremely important to personal safety. “Ignoring” isn’t appropriate advice to anyone who’s even been deluged with crap from a harasser.
Well it just depends on your mental fortitude. Harassers always stop when they don’t get a response, because your response is necessary for them to continue. Getting the messages at all can be upsetting, but the power is in your hands to delete them and not let it get to you.
No, harassers don’t always stop - this is a very simplistic view of things. Just ‘buck up’ and all will be well, eh? Have I misinterpreted your comments, or do you also believe that people who are on employment insurance are just lazy?
Case in point.
For me, blocking is one of the most important features any social app (chats, social media, etc) should have. I tried using Jabber to block my friend and had them message me from Xabber (from which I was entirely unable to block anyone), and their messages came through just fine. Months before that test, I had tried to test blocking someone else, but was unable to unblock them, even though all my clients said they weren’t blocked. I simply remained unable to message them, and the client kept telling me I had blocked their JID.
Could this have been an issue with the server I was using?
What client were you testing? It’s worth a bugreport if the block feature didn’t work as expected
It’s possible that the implementation leaves something to be desired. Because I have used this feature so little myself, I will have to investigate to see what is truly going on and know how the server handles it vs. how the client handles it. I am currently using Converations on my phone with a Disroot account, and I have someone blocked. When I go into “Account details” I can open “Show block list” in the drop-down menu and they are still there. (As they should be, lol.) I can hold down on it and elect to unblock them. My understanding is that the server keeps this list and doesn’t allow messages directly from that JID to even be delivered to my client. I can also imagine some clients not being aware of this at all.
Even though I blocked their JID, it’s possible we both can be in the same MUC and I get messages from them through the MUC itself. I’m not sure if it’s possible to block that without help from the MUC’s admin.
Edit: One caveat here is that if you block individual JID’s, someone could create more JID’s with which to message you. Some XMPP servers have this behavior whereby they silently delete all incoming messages from people you haven’t added to your roster, so this “add-first” policy helps them keep out spam. Ideally you would be able to contact your server admin in cases of abuse if it would become necessary to block problematic servers or warn the admins of said servers of abuse.
Yes that is not possible as only MUC admins actually know the real user JID (privacy feature), so a client can not know that the person in the MUC with the pseudonymous nick “marmulak” is the same user as the “[email protected]” on your block-list.