• Slatlun@lemmy.ml
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      4 years ago

      I think they’re saying electrical transmission should be centralized, but generation should not be. Problems with double negatives…

      • NotAGinger@lemmy.ml
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        4 years ago

        But transmission isn’t centralized, and can’t be centralized. Because its purpose is to transmit power from power generators (both centralized and decentralized) to (located elsewhere) loads.

        I assumed the OP meant generation because the other way around doesn’t make sense.

        I may also be thinking about the physical world with the OP thinking about ownership, but that makes even less sense. Transmission and generation should be paid for by the end users. Preferably in whatever way reduces their costs without making them a burden on other participants.

        Maybe the statement is talking about centralized ownership for the purposes of economies of scale. Even that can be broken down to cooperative ownership as much of the less urban areas of the United States already are.

        • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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          4 years ago

          I meant transmission, systems that maintain load balancing, etc. Generation of renewables should be decentralized, but requiring generators to comply with creating transmission lines to rural areas or cities will create a bunch of issues around who is responsible for what, standards mismatch, and extremely high cost for smaller populations. It doesn’t seem like a good idea to me.

      • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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        4 years ago

        Yes you’re correct. As per the question asked with the “NOT”, imo Electrical Grids should not be decentralized while generation should.

    • NotAGinger@lemmy.ml
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      4 years ago

      So distributed generation shouldn’t happen? As far as I know distributed generation is happening and it is likely to increase as time goes on. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributed_generation In general non-renewables should be centralized due to economies and efficiencies of scale but renewables almost have to be distributed due to the amount of space they take and localized weather effects.

      • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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        4 years ago

        Yes distributed generation is good. I said not generation in my first line. The wikipedia article you referenced doesn’t mention transmission grid infrastructure, I’m curious, who is responsible for that in a distributed grid anyway?

        • NotAGinger@lemmy.ml
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          4 years ago

          Transmission owners own transmission. Transmission operators operate transmission. Reliability coorfinators have a wide overview and exist to help keep the grid together.

          • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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            4 years ago

            IMO, the reliability coordinators, transmission owners, and transmission operators should be centralized while generation should be decentralized.

            This reminds me, the postal system should be centralized. A decentralized postal system would be an absolute mess.

      • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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        4 years ago

        The maintenance of the transmission lines, smart load balancing, maintenance, etc.

          • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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            4 years ago

            Maybe you could list our a couple of the good reasons? In Canada the provinces that have centralized electrical grids have the cheapest electricity while provinces with decentralized have the higher power costs. Passive aggressive comments are sometimes entertaining but usually they come off flat when there’s no empirical evidence to back them up. 😉

            • federico3@lemmy.ml
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              4 years ago

              Electrical grids across the world have been decentralized since the beginning - hence the name - for various reasons. Resilience: a long distance line can be disconnected due to a fault and the network need to be able to survive the fault without leaving users without power. Maintenance: you need to be able to disconnect the line without cutting power to users. Economics & corporate politics: even if generation or distribution is done by the government in many countries, the companies actually doing the work are often private. You don’t want a single company to have huge bargain power. Also: resilience from air strikes and carpet bombing (yes it’s a concern).

              It’s pretty common for datacenters to be connected to multiple power lines possibly from different providers for reliability.

              If this sounds similar to how the physical Internet is built it’s not unexpected.

              • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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                4 years ago

                Ahh, you’re talking about technical operations. I’m referring to governance. Yes, everything can be looked at in a decentralized way depending on the frame of reference. Good job!

                • federico3@lemmy.ml
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                  4 years ago

                  As mentioned in other answers, a lot of governance is decentralized (e.g. across different countries) as well.

                  • Nevar@lemmy.ml
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                    4 years ago

                    Just to repeat, what is and what should be are different questions. Gold star for getting the What is part right though!