“Some people are weaponizing that language” is a VERY different statement than “anyone who uses that language is almost certainly weaponizing it”. You’re alienating allies by accusing them if being enemies.
“Some people are weaponizing that language” is a VERY different statement than “anyone who uses that language is almost certainly weaponizing it”.
I never said that. In fact, I ended my last reply with “Even when it isn’t being weaponized”. I said people who say things like “queer people are obsessed with labels” and “I’m not cis; I’m normal”, which are both disparaging comments, are more than likely doing so in response to encountering identities and experiences outside of cishetnormativity. It’s one thing to say that there are a lot of labels used, and you find some of them either dubious or unneccessary, and another to say that people are obsessed or making up labels for attention.
Whenever people say that someone’s choice of labels is simply attention seeking or naive, how often are these people actually listening and engaging with the person’s reasoning for identifying with the said label, and show give actual evidence for said attention seeking? In my experience, the only argument I’ve seen being used against labels that people identify with is “I’ve never heard of it nor do I understand it, therefore it’s not real.” Claiming that “queer people are obsessed with labels” is a broad generalization that comes of as a knee jerk reaction.
You’re alienating allies by accusing them if being enemies.
All I’m asking is that people think whenever they feel the need to dismiss others and gatekeep identities from people. In my experience, this seems to be based more on people’s gut reactions rather than science, facts, or logic, like they claim it is.
Whenever I’ve seen people disparage certain labels like non-binary or demisexual, they never seem to have actually listen to someone with said identity and engage with their reasoning. It’s far more common for them to decide that they’re attention seeking, deluded, or mentally ill.
And if people are going to be allies, there are going to be times when they need to examine their behaviour. Any self-proclaimed ally who says that “I have nothing against queer people, but why are they so obsessed with labels?” needs to re-examine their arguments just like anyone who says “I have nothing against women, but why are they so emotional and sensitive?” or “I have nothing against black people, but why are they so violent?”.
“But when people say queer people are obsessed with labels, or “I’m not cis; I’m normal”, what they’re almost certainly taking issue with is non-cisheteronormativity being recognized and validated.” - Umechan
I think younger queer people are obsessed with labels, and I am not taking issue with non cishet people being recognized and validated. And I’m pretty confident that’s a frequent and normal mindset. You keep taking about other, more radical, obviously trans or homophobic statements, but we’re not talking about any of that. Just labels.
It’s one thing to say that there are a lot of labels used, and you find some of them either dubious or unneccessary,
Yes, and that is the one thing I am saying. Not “I’m not cis, I’m normal”. Not “people are obsessed or making up labels for attention.” Not “I’ve never heard of it nor do I understand it, therefore it’s not real.” Not “they’re attention seeking, deluded, or mentally ill.”
I don’t know who you’re arguing with here, but it ain’t me.
I had a whole rant about how I’ve been involved in the queer space since I was seven, and how insulting it is to be subtly called a bigot, but it’s not worth it. You want to argue with a bigot and by god if you can’t find one you’ll pretend I am one. This is a pointless discussion.
“Some people are weaponizing that language” is a VERY different statement than “anyone who uses that language is almost certainly weaponizing it”. You’re alienating allies by accusing them if being enemies.
I never said that. In fact, I ended my last reply with “Even when it isn’t being weaponized”. I said people who say things like “queer people are obsessed with labels” and “I’m not cis; I’m normal”, which are both disparaging comments, are more than likely doing so in response to encountering identities and experiences outside of cishetnormativity. It’s one thing to say that there are a lot of labels used, and you find some of them either dubious or unneccessary, and another to say that people are obsessed or making up labels for attention.
Whenever people say that someone’s choice of labels is simply attention seeking or naive, how often are these people actually listening and engaging with the person’s reasoning for identifying with the said label, and show give actual evidence for said attention seeking? In my experience, the only argument I’ve seen being used against labels that people identify with is “I’ve never heard of it nor do I understand it, therefore it’s not real.” Claiming that “queer people are obsessed with labels” is a broad generalization that comes of as a knee jerk reaction.
All I’m asking is that people think whenever they feel the need to dismiss others and gatekeep identities from people. In my experience, this seems to be based more on people’s gut reactions rather than science, facts, or logic, like they claim it is.
Whenever I’ve seen people disparage certain labels like non-binary or demisexual, they never seem to have actually listen to someone with said identity and engage with their reasoning. It’s far more common for them to decide that they’re attention seeking, deluded, or mentally ill.
And if people are going to be allies, there are going to be times when they need to examine their behaviour. Any self-proclaimed ally who says that “I have nothing against queer people, but why are they so obsessed with labels?” needs to re-examine their arguments just like anyone who says “I have nothing against women, but why are they so emotional and sensitive?” or “I have nothing against black people, but why are they so violent?”.
“But when people say queer people are obsessed with labels, or “I’m not cis; I’m normal”, what they’re almost certainly taking issue with is non-cisheteronormativity being recognized and validated.” - Umechan
I think younger queer people are obsessed with labels, and I am not taking issue with non cishet people being recognized and validated. And I’m pretty confident that’s a frequent and normal mindset. You keep taking about other, more radical, obviously trans or homophobic statements, but we’re not talking about any of that. Just labels.
Yes, and that is the one thing I am saying. Not “I’m not cis, I’m normal”. Not “people are obsessed or making up labels for attention.” Not “I’ve never heard of it nor do I understand it, therefore it’s not real.” Not “they’re attention seeking, deluded, or mentally ill.”
I don’t know who you’re arguing with here, but it ain’t me.
I had a whole rant about how I’ve been involved in the queer space since I was seven, and how insulting it is to be subtly called a bigot, but it’s not worth it. You want to argue with a bigot and by god if you can’t find one you’ll pretend I am one. This is a pointless discussion.