Why is the cost of living so incredibly high in the US?
It cannot be because of consumer goods. Because both Europe and the US have similar prices for those since they are made by international companies.
It cannot be food, the US is a big exporter of food. And those exports go to countries with lower costs of living.
It cannot be vacations. You could “just” fly to Europe and have european vacation prices.
Is it just housing and healthcare?
That’s a large portion of it yes. Don’t forget that 150k salary is before taxes. The cost of food has sky rocketed lately. Don’t forget transportation. If you live in a big city you might take a bus or Metro, but for most Americans there isn’t a good network so add gas, car insurance, and possibly a car payment if you don’t own. And if you have kids get ready for child care expenses, unless you have a stay at home parent… But then you only have one income. Rent, utilities, little glasses for Timmy, cell phone bills and those TV subscriptions you’re slowly sailing the high seas on as they nickel and dime you. It all adds up.
Europeans also buy little glasses for Timmy and such. I don’t think the price of those kind of things is much different. Same for utilities, phone and TV. The one I’m most uncertain about is utilities, but I believe electricity at least is usually cheaper in america.
The car one is fair. Although it’s true that in Europe there’s also tons of people on cars, public transit is at least a valid option, unlike in much of the US.
Taxes is not though. Taxes in america are usually way lower than in Europe.
So transportation+healthcare are the only expenses that are clearly more expensive in america. Housing being highly dependant on location is hard to compare nation-based. And it’s also the biggest component. I’d be curious to see the actual “living wage” difference between two places, one Europeans and another American with similar housing prices.
wow, what afucking shithole of an economic system, huh?
Yeah, this hits home all right. I’m Gen-X, and while I always got by OK on a very low income even here in Seattle, it was entirely due to have a very modest lifestyle and the sheer luck of that rarest of Seattle unicorns, reasonable rent.
The stars aligned, and over the course of only a few years I’ve suddenly moved into a very comfortable 6 figure salary, and oh holy jebus words cannot express how much stress just…evaporates…when you’ve got enough to cover all expenses and easily sock away some money too.
Of course, that was promptly replaced by a new stress, the realization that I might just possibly thread the needle and end up with a comfortable retirement—not rich mind you, just not in penury—but I now had to save, save, save, save, save.
Work affords me access to both a 403B and a 457B, which has helped immensely in my quest to get savings built up appropriate for my age bracket, but all that anxiety is back now that I’ve got a retirement fund that was on track, but now the orange twitiot is doing his damndest to wreck our economy, likely for good. I’m just waiting to watch everything I’ve invested go up in smoke. It’s nerve-wracking, but hey, at least I’m Gen-X and know exactly what it’s like to live with existential dread. After a childhood fearing nuclear holocaust at any moment, this new anxiety is practically a cakewalk!
Oh, who am I kidding? It still sucks.
Fuck.Just want to say, to a fellow slacker, I get you. OTOH, my nerves aren’t too wrecked yet. Like you, I know how to be poor, but fuck me, I didn’t expect an environmental and political holocaust to drop on my old ass.
Yeah, sounds about right if you want to be able to be comfortable at home and have money for maybe a modest vacation once a year.
I make way less, but it would be nice to be able to afford to travel at least once a year. Not worry about car repairs setting me back etc etc.
Don’t forget any shot at a reasonable retirement too
I’m planning to die to reduce my spend.
That is, most literally, my plan. Not going to suicide, but either the environment or shit politics will take me out before I’m too elderly.
And I’m not being snarky. No healthcare and seeing the ecosystem collapse has done me in. And for the young, you haven’t seen the shit I’ve seen. Our systems are racing towards a cliff. You’d be even madder if you had lived my young life and seen where we’re at now.
I’m either going to die in the water riots or I’ll be shot dead by a Google Amazon compliance assistance team for using an adblocker.
Who cares what people “feel”? It has nothing to do with “feelings”. Just calculate how much it actually costs to live comfortably, and you’ll find that $150k works.
You can’t define “comfortably” without feeling.
You can, though. At least to the extent of saying that “comfortable” means that all your basic needs are met, and you have money left over for more than that. How much more, is a matter of preference…but as long as that basic minimum is met, the rest is just different degrees of comfort.
Well, then I can say that $40k is definitely “comfortable.” That’s $1500 rent, $300/month food, another $200 gas/elec/internet, a thousand left over for odds & ends and another couple hundred saved.
Pretty much my budget in a MCOL major metro.
What about taxes? Health Insurance? Car insurance or transportation budget. You can live comfortably on $10 a day for food?? $3.30 a meal? That eats up the rest of that $1300 a month and leaves nothing for entertainment, savings, gifts or dating. Nothing left for meeting that health insurance deductible so you still can’t go to the doctor. Survivable? Absolutely! Doesn’t sound comfortable to me though.
Don’t really have taxes at that income level. In the US, ACA pays full insurancne premium (currently, that will change if the billionaire tax cut passes), and ‘wellness checkups’ are $0 out-of-pocket by law. Most of my dinner recipes are around $2.50/serving at 900 calories. I’m able to walk most places I go, but car insurance is $100/month. Don’t feel like dating, raising kids, or making big vacations. I average something around $7-800/month on ‘entertainment’ like video games & hobby materials, which leaves $300-400 savings. $350/month is 10%, which is around 2x the US average savings rate (https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PSAVERT). Savings for emergencies like insurance deductible and for retirement.
But that’s my point: my housing probably isn’t everyone’s idea of ‘comfortable,’ my diet is pretty carb-heavy and probably not everyone’s idea of ‘comfortable.’ I like it, though. It feels comfortable to me; I don’t consciously restrict any of my spending - all the numbers I’ve given you are post hoc analysis. I’ve been doing it for a decade.
I don’t dispute people feeling like they need $150k to live comfortably. Lots of people want kids. Lots of people want to take a nice vacation time-to-time. There’s a massive propaganda machine out there trying to convince everyone that they need just a little more than they have right now to feel good about themselves, and I believe that propaganda starts wearing thin by the time you get to $150k, $200k. They’ve got to live their life; I can only live mine.
You don’t have kids? Plan to retire? Have an emergency savings amount? No credit card debt? Car loans? Student loans?
I probably should have been more clear when I said “minimum basic requirements”. I wasn’t talking “survival”…I was talking about “comfort”. The point at which you are no longer living paycheck-to-paycheck.
I was also assuming household income…not individual…so I should have been more specific there, as well.
I make about twice what you calculated, and my bank account is consistently at zero after all my household expenses are covered. That’s for my family…not just me. I have no emergency savings, which means if anything in my life breaks down, I go into debt just to pay for repairs…and it takes months to finish paying it off. That’s not “comfortable”. It’s eternally stressful, since emergencies like that usually come up more often than I can pay off the last one.
My point, though, was that it’s all quantifiable. Even the differences between individual circumstances can be calculated. Everyone can look at their life and “know” the number that would get them into that “comfort zone”.
That’s what I said: “Comfortable” depends on feelings. Once you know what feels comfortable, then you can quantify.
Particularly since that has to also include investing for later retirement in an entirely uncertain economic future.
