cross-posted from: https://lemmy.sdf.org/post/1085247
Just putting this here for those who might miss it.
I saw season 1 and it was…okay? I gather that Wheel of Time diehards were upset about plot deviations. I never read the books so that didn’t matter much to me. IMO the world setting seemed janky - it was as though Robert Jordan couldn’t build an original world to save his life and borrowed bits and pieces of different Earth cultures and threw them in a blender. I could pass on the next season but I have too many people around me who will want to watch it so I feel somewhat compelled to.
What did you think of season 1? Will you be watching season 2?
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I lost all interest early on in season 1 but watched through the train wreck out of morbid curiosity. I have no interest in watching further.
As a fan of the books, flaws and all, the show writers have ignored or flat out contradicted key plot elements and missed fundamental world building beats.
Lan having a big fit crying and screaming at a funeral is such a stark contrast to his novel character that it cannot be reconciled.
This is like making Aragorn a misogynist, or having him bully the hobbits for being so short. Just a complete backflip.
Lan having a big fit crying and screaming at a funeral is such a stark contrast to his novel character that it cannot be reconciled.
Wait, Lan did what?
He also spent most of the show sulking around and being a soft-ass emo dude. It was really annoying.
I am all for a different interpretation, but I was looking forward to a really bad-ass Lan.
Afaik that Lan bit was inspired by something from some asian culture(s). And your analogies are really terrible. I also didn’t like that version of Lan, but you come across as someone who tries to dislike it.
So not inspired or informed by the character and his culture from the novels.
You come across as someone who brown noses pathetic hack writers.
Try reading the whole comment
If a ‘Wheel of Time diehard’ includes someone in the middle of their 6th reread, then I guess I contradict your assumption. I thoroughly enjoyed the 1st season, even with its minor flaws, and predict the 2nd season will be even better. I generally enjoyed the plot deviations and saw them as improvements.
If anything, a WoT fan that is honest with themselves should a) be able to overlook minor flaws, since the books have plenty, especially book 1 and b) realize that plot deviations are a must because an at most 8 season series cannot follow all of Jordan’s arcs and details faithfully - combine, rearrange, and cut is absolutely required.
To me, the heart of the story is there, the characters are well-acted, and the music is great. Sets and writing were good in season 1 with some room for improvement, IMO.
I am actually pleased that you think the world-building “borrowed bits and pieces of different Earth cultures and threw them in a blender.” That’s completely intentional and follows from the metaphysics and history (e.g., the Age of Legends and subsequent breaking of the world) in the books. It might not be everyone’s cup of tea though, sure.
Finally, with a small sample size of friends and family I am having a much easier time getting them into WoT than I did GoT (the last fantasy show I really got into). Reasons (I am paraphrasing their words) include:
More accessible color pallette and atmosphere
Less gratuitous violence (especially towards women)
More magic and “fantasy” feel
Refreshingly not a standard medieval setting
Being able to share it with more people in my circle has obviously enhanced my enjoyment. They are all super pumped after seeing the season 2 trailer.
Honestly I think (or hope) that most “diehards” are in this category. Normal people aren’t vocal on reddit/twitter/rotten tomatoes/imdb etc.
With that said, season 1 had some major issues, many of which can be attributed to covid restrictions and Mat being cut (well, the actor leaving) but not all. I personally hope that they find their groove for season 3 onwards.
I enjoyed season 1, I will most likely enjoy season 2.
There hasn’t been much actual discussion because you have to wade through endless posts of neckbeard spam.
The actual Season 2 trailer can be found at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-1OT1jxuQo
I had to put away my interpretations of the books and let the TV series stand on its own. Once I did that, I thought it was pretty cool. Looking forward to season two!
I read Brandon’s post where he discussed this, and he recommended it too. He said something along the lines of, The Wheel of Time turns. Ages come and pass, and this is another 3rd age, different from the 3rd age in the books, and in this age, this is how things happened.
I’m going to preface this by stating that I did like the show.
It is different, and it had it’s problems, as all shows do. But Sanderson was overly cautious in his language early on. On his podcast, at a later time, he was a little more critical, though he did still stick to it being another turning of the wheel. He said there were some changes made that he would not have made. But he also added a lot more context with those criticisms. Covid hit mid-production, and the complications that brought meant they had to rethink a lot of what they wanted to do and how to do it. But the showrunner is a huge WOT fan and the intended changes were done with thought and intent. I probably won’t agree with a lot of them, but that’s what happens when someone else creates a thing and I don’t. I still liked the show, and the 2nd season will likely be much improved now that Covid restrictions aren’t so harsh. Though I’ll miss the actor who played Matt. I really liked his portrayal.
Thanks for the input. I specifically bought a month of Prime to watch the show, but didn’t realize the full show wasn’t out, and then I got busy with other stuff and didn’t get around to watching it.
I’ll give it another try when second season has released.
What happened to Matt’s actor?
He decided to leave after the first season. I wasn’t sure why originally. When it was announced they refused to say. But I did just check and it sounds like he didn’t want to get vaccinated possibly? So good riddance I guess. Real shame. As a reader of the books, it really felt like he embodied that character better than most. But the character is kind of a piece of shit, so I guess it fits.
Heh.
Thanks for the info.
I have good news and bad news: I agree with all of this and I too think it will only get better, but much of season 2 was filmed with covid restrictions.
Hopefully with planning for it this time. It won’t come as a surprise midway through filming, so they won’t have to scramble and change all the plans they had after the work they already did was done with more freedom. Fingers crossed.
He also heavily alluded to the fact that he doesn’t like what they did with the show and outright said that they ignored his input. He said if he ever has an opportunity to get a film deal he’ll insist on full control and won’t do it otherwise.
Oh, that’s sad. Let’s hope he gets better deals with rest of his work.
It’s not his work per-se, he just finished it. He’s a WOT expert obviously, but this is not his work (yet).
Yeah, you are right. The full rights belong to Jordan estate, and if they are happy, it doesn’t matter.
I agree with you btw, I hope he can do Mistborn movies with full control :)
I tried that several times. It doesn’t stand as an extension of the books and it doesn’t stand on its own. It’s sooo ridiculously boring and contrived.
What a trash-ass show. It’s a damned shame too, because I loved the books. I read the entire series and was very excited for a show or movie. When I heard Amazon got the rights to it I was apprehensive, but cautiously hopeful. Unfortunately my caution was fully warranted. Rafe is a hack, as is the writing staff. The hubris of that team to completely ignore Sanderson’s advice and re-write a beloved classic, to make such an awful show is unbelievable.
I never read the books, so I thought the series was really great, except for the season finale. I hope season two is good, it looks promising to me.
I also really disliked the finale. Covid restrictions did affect it a lot apparently, but it was bad. As a book reader I was surprised at how vague they made everything. It feels like a lot of sudden weirdness wasn’t explained. I think season 2 will clear some of that up at least.
I enjoyed season 1 outside of a handful of sequences that felt forced or meh. Looking forward to season 2
My biggest gripe about season 1 was how sparkling clean their clothes looked.
Rand’s woolly jumper was shining, no balling, freshly woven, from perfectly spun threads - they’re all supposed to be mediaeval farmers in a remote village who’s only contact with the cities was an occasional travelling merchant, everything should have been old, had a layer of grime, clumps etc.
Other than that I thought it was pretty good.
They’re actually specifically not in a medieval fantasy setting. That doesn’t mean that their clothes should be pristine, but most people seem to simply have a problem with this not being LOTR style.
Yes, agreed. I’ve read the books.
Should have skipped that phrasing. My point was in regards to the goods availability setting, not era, that is: Remote, mostly self sufficient, agricultural village, mostly dirt roads, in a setting were as far as they knew or was practically used, the fastest form of transport was horseback, with 0 automation.
It doesn’t give a lot of room for “pulled the clothing from the shelf”.
Perhaps a stretched argument could be made for the main characters, in that they were special, but then it’s not mentioned in the books, other characters don’t remark on it, and all characters are dressed like that.
(Except for the aes sedai, and especially Moiraine who is continuously singled out for how she always looks pristine in almost all circumstances)
I came across this Tor article which gives a bit more insight: https://www.tor.com/2023/07/19/the-wheel-of-time-robert-jordan-season-two-trailer-prime/
I’m really excited. It looks really good!
No one is talking about the critical change they made to the magic system. In the books, the problem with The Dragon is he can use magic, but the magic men can access has been tainted and blah blah blah. The takeaway is that women can still safely use magic, and keep on restraining men who can so they don’t destroy the world.
This could have been done in such a way that would not only have opened the possibility for a woman to be the Dragon, but would have made it just as hard to determine not just who the Dragon was, but would bring in a test to determine if every magic user had the potential to be the Dragon, both men and women, let alone trans magic users. But instead, they insist that maybe this woman could be the Dragon, then portray everything else like it was in the book, leading to the likely conclusion that the Dragon will still be a man. And if the Dragon is still going to be a man, for very consistent in-world reasons which would also make sense for the characters, why pretend it was going to be anything different? If you have a problem with The Dragon having to be a man, wouldn’t it be more frustrating for the Dragon to not have to be a man and it ends up being a man, anyway?
I have a number of other criticisms - oddly weakening characters, distorting their motivations for no obvious reasons, etc. - but this is the only one I saw as actually world-breaking.
I’ll probably watch it (assuming it’s free with Prime) but based on this trailer I’m not really seeing much that looks engaging from a plot perspective
That’s not how trailers work. Time will tell.
It’s not? There have been plenty of trailers that provide more overview of plot (without giving it away), but over time they’ve become more about fireballs, panoramas and explosions.
IMO This trailer for Season 2 is much better. I already know that he series is pretty. I want to know if it’ll have more plot and direction.
Well, like you say, most are fireballs, panoramas and explosions, with vague sentences. That one is indeed much better, referencing the end of season 1, and glimpses that mean a lot for book readers. I think it’ll have much more direction than s1 at least.
