Not sure how to approach this so I’ll just spew some thoughts.
Is there anything morally or legally wrong with taking pictures of MAGA-flag waving homes, looking the owners up on the local tax site and posting that information online? Pic, name, address, nothing else.
To my thoughts, they’re proudly waving a flag promoting their beliefs. Could they legally complain for spreading that information? Isn’t that the very purpose of a flag? Is it even doxxing when they proudly fly their flags? This isn’t some person wishing to remain anonymous.
I’m certain lemmy would shut such a community down, in a New York minute, but why? If there are no calls for violence or harassment, why not help them spread their message?
Could such a site be deployed, perhaps outside social media? Zero chance of making such a site untraceable?
Got to nearly shaking in anger the other night as my legal, brown wife expressed her terror of being deported. Filipino FB is full of rumors and fear, and it seems mostly that, rumors. But we all know this administration won’t stop with illegals.
I’m scared shitless, she’s scared shitless, can we make the supporters scared shitless? And again, they’re flying a flag, advertising to the world how they feel. Why should that make them afraid? And if they are, what can they do about it?
They are already doing this, in a much more mechanized way.
https://www.wired.com/story/license-plate-readers-political-signs-bumper-stickers/
What good are you expecting to come from this doxxing?
What prevents someone from lying about someone they don’t like?
Nothing about this is a good idea.
What prevents someone from lying
Photographic evidence? Are you imagining someone will install a flagpole and run a Trump flag up? And yes, such a comm or site would have to look carefully for fakes, I get that.
What good? I want them exposed and fearful. They are the ones advertising, I merely suggest we help. Why should that be a problem?
Lemmy is constantly quoting: “Nothing will happen until the rich fear for their lives.”
Well, I can’t do anything about the rich, but I can expose their foot soldiers.
FFS, we’ve already had a sheriff on FB talking (before the election) about doxxing people with Biden flags, and you’re pearl-clutching over this?
There are tens of millions of Trump supporters. Focusing efforts on punishing them is completely pointless.
Your time is much better spent identifying, locating, and organizing action against leaders in the movement, not rank and file.
<ModeratorHat>
- Do not identify yourself or anyone else here.
“Anyone else” means anyone else. Why? Because we don’t need to be bringing any heat down on fedia, where this space lives, and we don’t need to be getting shut down (either by fedia or otherwise). Marathon, not a sprint, so let’s not go running off a cliff.
</ModeratorHat>
<OldManHat>
Back in my day, if you wanted to say a bunch of stupid shit, not very many people could hear you when you said it, and the people who did knew exactly who you were. The nearest analog then was letters to the editor of the local newspaper, and the only people who read those were people who wanted to laugh at crazy people who write letters to the editor of the local newspaper.
</OldManHat>
Now, anyone can spout off anything under any number of anonymous pseudonyms simultaneously, without having anyone right in front of them to set them straight. They don’t even have to come back and read opposing comments afterwards if they don’t want to. Even if they do, it’s just words on a screen, not a “real live person,” so it’s a whole lot easier to either dig heels in or turn the troll mode up to eleven.
While I think that if people had to very personally be accountable for what they say, things might be different today, the fact that an arbitrary person’s voice and identity can reach a much larger audience now, and that audience is much more empowered to play fuck around with that information has made it so there’s no going back.
Remember that if you’re doxxing people who deserve it, you’re putting yourself out there for the same treatment. Maybe other unrelated people, too. Proceed with caution.
… can we make the supporters scared shitless?
@[email protected] posted a thread about making some posters/flyers to put up. I think this is a really good idea, and may serve as an answer to your question there. Demonstrating that there are people who are willing to stand up, in a “you don’t know who, where, when, or how many of us there are” way might help.
Addressing people directly is another way, although that also carries some risk. See someone with a MAGA hat on? “HOLY SHIT, IT’S A NAZI!” See someone with a Trump bumper sticker on their car? “Excuse me, I figured you might want to know that there’s some Nazi shit on your rear bumper.” And then walk away.
“Remember when we used to shoot Nazis?” Walk away. Stay calm at all times, and don’t react impulsively.
The message is “I see you. I am watching you.” Would “some kind of subversive action” be even more effective? Perhaps, but that’s a greater personal risk to you. Proceed with caution.
Thank you so much. I have much to chew on.
Funny, I just finished Tchaikovsky’s sci-fy novel Alien Clay.
From your linked post:
word needs to go out to the general public to build solidarity and make them feel part of a greater whole. Resistors are not alone!
The lack of solidarity was the reason resistances kept going down. Won’t spoil the novel, but a way presented itself for the resistance to fight back with total solidarity. (Crap. Maybe I spoiled it already.)
I imagine most Lemmy instances would take issue with you doxxing people, famous or otherwise. There’s nothing stopping you from setting up geocities.com/lookatthesetraitors other than potential legal repercussions.
You’re asking my own questions! Is it doxxing? These people expressed no wish to be anonymous, they’re advertising.
Legal repercussions? I’m asking that as well.
Take a picture of a house. Nothing illegal. Look up the owner in public records. Nothing illegal. Post names and address on the internet, with no additional comment. I’m asking if there could be an angle for legal action.
I know, we’re not lawyers, but I’ll call mine tomorrow. (I’m not rich enough to have a lawyer on retainer, but I have Legal Shield insurance and it’s a free call and opinion.)
An amateur webmaster like a Lemmy admins will almost certainly consider it too risky. A lawyer, especially a “free” one, will tell you not to go borrowing trouble. They won’t want any of that smoke.
Personally I don’t think it’s illegal, but IANAL.
Talked to many lawyers? I’m not too experienced, but I find they give you solid scenarios and risk/reward talk.
In other words, they refuse to say yea or nay. Instead they simply tell it how it is, as their experience and education see it. You’re free to take the advice or roll your own rope as you see fit.
Don’t want this to turn into an ad, but for $26/mo., having a lawyer on the phone in an hour, or instantly if the situation is that hot, is well worth it. We peons keep getting fucked and fucked and fucked because we have no idea where we stand legally.
Lawyers aren’t just for murder cases and divorces, they can answer super simple shit as well, shit that may not be so simple to us laymen.
