My issue with the Laptop 16 is more about the design of the computer itself, how it’s positioned, and the need it serves—things that are more fundamental and harder to fix.
Design is subjective. I think it’s beautiful and extremely functional.
The need it serves is a laptop that doesn’t have to be replaced every few years. Saves money in the long term, helps the environment, and is far more future proof than anything else.
Not hard. Framework has been killing it with their previous models.
Once you’re spending more than $2,000 on a 5-pound laptop, most people would be better off buying multiple computers—an inexpensive thin-and-light laptop for battery life and portability, plus a good midrange desktop for performance and comfort.
Does this guy live in the real world? This sounds like sarcasm, but it’s not.
The bad
Relatively expensive for what you’re getting.
On the larger and heavier end of the 15-to-16-inch > laptop spectrum.
GPU module adds a lot of size and weight.
Upgradeability currently more of a hypothetical >future benefit, though Framework does have an >established track record now.
Expensive yes, but you are getting a lot. And you save money in the long-term.
Larger end… Yeah, it’s a 16" laptop…
GPU is optional, and anyone who needs it in a laptop are willing to take that weight penalty.
Upgradability is a hypothetical future benefit? Framework already offers upgrades to their other models. And even a battery swap, which isn’t always possible, easy, or budget friendly, is a snap.
This review is so short slighted, and seems to miss the actual point of owning a framework laptop.
This review is so short slighted, and seems to miss the actual point of owning a framework laptop.
I feel like laptop reviewers, who go through dozens of laptops in a year to test new models, are inherently the wrong audience for something that isn’t meant to be top of the line horsepower and sleek. No shade to them, I get the desire to have a 3lbs slim device that can video edit on the lap on a subway or whatever, but this thing is big and bulky so that parts are easier to access and nothing is soldered down. It’s basically perfect for me as long as it runs.
Once you’re spending more than $2,000 on a 5-pound laptop, most people would be better off buying multiple computers—an inexpensive thin-and-light laptop for battery life and portability, plus a good midrange desktop for performance and comfort.
Does this guy live in the real world? This sounds like sarcasm, but it’s not.
It’s so frustrating to be able to see the negative externalities in plain sight and be unable to firmly advise against them because the system considers them free in order to make something of immediate importance to the person possible. E.g. make ends meet by spending $500 less on a laptop you need today by generating more ewaste in the process.
I think the audience he is writing for is more the gamer, regular consumer type of user. People who need power for games, not workloads. The kinds of people who talk about repairable portable workstations on a federated social media platform are likely not his ordinary audience lol
The whole conversation about ports misses the not-so-obvious point that the cartridge system saves the motherboard ports from destruction. This is extremely important for long-term use. Ports not only have limited cycle life but get killed by happenstances in life. Standard laptops lose ports over time. That can only be fixed by board replacement. On a Framework, it’s $20 and a cartridge reload.
Then there’s the cooling… A laptop with adequate cooling for its hardware… What is this this - the 2000s? With that kind of cooling capacity, this machine will last for a very long time.
Ports not only have limited cycle life but get killed by happenstances in life. Standard laptops lose ports over time. That can only be fixed by board replacement. On a Framework, it’s $20 and a cartridge reload.
This is so true! Whether it’s the power port, a standard USB port, or your HDMI port, damaging it on a regular laptop can either be costly or impossible to fix without a full mobo replacement.
Looking back at all the laptops I’ve owned that needed to be replaced because repairs were either non-existent or too expensive, I realize that every single one of them could have been saved if they’d been Framework laptops.
I love my Framework 13, but when it comes time for my wife to replace her current laptop (a 17" Dell that’s been a workhorse for over a decade), I’ll be getting the Framework 16 and she’ll have the 13. I don’t think I could ever go with another brand after my experience.
The port in my old XPS 15 can be has been replaced in 10 minutes with a screwdriver, with a $5 replacement port. I honestly don’t even love the laptop but I can’t fault it’s repairability.
My point is while this framework laptop is insanely cool, I don’t think that repairability is as huge an advantage as it’s made out to be. Beats a macbook I guess, but for a lot of mainstream laptops the only difference in repairability is needing a screwdriver set and I little more time (negligible imo since I only need to repair/upgrade maybe every 2-3 years. maybe)
You’re lucky your XPS’es port is replaceable without a mainboard swap. Is this true for all ports?
Also the repairability comparison with mainstream machines lacks a crucial point. The availability of genuine parts and for reasonable prices. A Framework battery runs me about 60-70 bucks. A genuine battery for my ThinkPad has typically been closer to $150. If I could even find one.
Hold on, the battery’s another thing I had to replace. Let me find how much I paid.
Edit: I paid a little less than $50 on eBay from ebl. They’re a reputable seller, I bought rechargeable AAA’s from them more than five years ago and they’re still kicking
**ebl. **They’re a reputable seller, I bought rechargeable AAA’s from them more than five years ago and they’re still kicking
I have a ton of EBL batteries. And my reality was confirmed when Project Farm did a “one year later” follow-up, which confirmed what I was experiencing: EBL batteries are garbage. LOL
I haven’t done any real tests so I guess I’ll defer to you on that. It’s been more than three years of daily use since installing the laptop battery though, so I’d say the fact that I haven’t noticed a significant drop in battery life means that $50 is no less then a fair price.
Design is subjective. I think it’s beautiful and extremely functional.
The need it serves is a laptop that doesn’t have to be replaced every few years. Saves money in the long term, helps the environment, and is far more future proof than anything else.
Not hard. Framework has been killing it with their previous models.
Does this guy live in the real world? This sounds like sarcasm, but it’s not.
Expensive yes, but you are getting a lot. And you save money in the long-term.
Larger end… Yeah, it’s a 16" laptop…
GPU is optional, and anyone who needs it in a laptop are willing to take that weight penalty.
Upgradability is a hypothetical future benefit? Framework already offers upgrades to their other models. And even a battery swap, which isn’t always possible, easy, or budget friendly, is a snap.
This review is so short slighted, and seems to miss the actual point of owning a framework laptop.
I feel like laptop reviewers, who go through dozens of laptops in a year to test new models, are inherently the wrong audience for something that isn’t meant to be top of the line horsepower and sleek. No shade to them, I get the desire to have a 3lbs slim device that can video edit on the lap on a subway or whatever, but this thing is big and bulky so that parts are easier to access and nothing is soldered down. It’s basically perfect for me as long as it runs.
Double your e-waste with this one simple trick 👍
It’s so frustrating to be able to see the negative externalities in plain sight and be unable to firmly advise against them because the system considers them free in order to make something of immediate importance to the person possible. E.g. make ends meet by spending $500 less on a laptop you need today by generating more ewaste in the process.
I think the audience he is writing for is more the gamer, regular consumer type of user. People who need power for games, not workloads. The kinds of people who talk about repairable portable workstations on a federated social media platform are likely not his ordinary audience lol
I love the aesthetic design.
The whole conversation about ports misses the not-so-obvious point that the cartridge system saves the motherboard ports from destruction. This is extremely important for long-term use. Ports not only have limited cycle life but get killed by happenstances in life. Standard laptops lose ports over time. That can only be fixed by board replacement. On a Framework, it’s $20 and a cartridge reload.
Then there’s the cooling… A laptop with adequate cooling for its hardware… What is this this - the 2000s? With that kind of cooling capacity, this machine will last for a very long time.
This is so true! Whether it’s the power port, a standard USB port, or your HDMI port, damaging it on a regular laptop can either be costly or impossible to fix without a full mobo replacement.
Looking back at all the laptops I’ve owned that needed to be replaced because repairs were either non-existent or too expensive, I realize that every single one of them could have been saved if they’d been Framework laptops.
I love my Framework 13, but when it comes time for my wife to replace her current laptop (a 17" Dell that’s been a workhorse for over a decade), I’ll be getting the Framework 16 and she’ll have the 13. I don’t think I could ever go with another brand after my experience.
The port in my old XPS 15
can behas been replaced in 10 minutes with a screwdriver, with a $5 replacement port. I honestly don’t even love the laptop but I can’t fault it’s repairability.My point is while this framework laptop is insanely cool, I don’t think that repairability is as huge an advantage as it’s made out to be. Beats a macbook I guess, but for a lot of mainstream laptops the only difference in repairability is needing a screwdriver set and I little more time (negligible imo since I only need to repair/upgrade maybe every 2-3 years. maybe)
You’re lucky your XPS’es port is replaceable without a mainboard swap. Is this true for all ports?
Also the repairability comparison with mainstream machines lacks a crucial point. The availability of genuine parts and for reasonable prices. A Framework battery runs me about 60-70 bucks. A genuine battery for my ThinkPad has typically been closer to $150. If I could even find one.
Hold on, the battery’s another thing I had to replace. Let me find how much I paid.
Edit: I paid a little less than $50 on eBay from ebl. They’re a reputable seller, I bought rechargeable AAA’s from them more than five years ago and they’re still kicking
I have a ton of EBL batteries. And my reality was confirmed when Project Farm did a “one year later” follow-up, which confirmed what I was experiencing: EBL batteries are garbage. LOL
I haven’t done any real tests so I guess I’ll defer to you on that. It’s been more than three years of daily use since installing the laptop battery though, so I’d say the fact that I haven’t noticed a significant drop in battery life means that $50 is no less then a fair price.
Ok I just looked up oem, damn I’m cheap lol: https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/dell-6-cell-97-wh-lithium-ion-replacement-battery-for-select-laptops/apd/gpm03/pc-accessories
No not all ports, just power and and auxilary, but I honestly can’t recall a single time that I’ve lost a usb port.
Here’s the (excellent) repair docs if you’re interested: https://dl.dell.com/topicspdf/xps-15-9560-laptop_Setup-Guide_en-us.pdf
My old latitude from 2011 is similarly easy to repair, it’s running a jellyfin server rn.
I’ve lost USB-A on a ThinkPad and a miniDP. The USB went from use, the miniDP got destroyed in an accident.