Belgian Defence Minister Ludivine Dedonder has announced that the country will send several Belgian F-16 fighter jets to Ukraine, starting from 2025.
    • Heresy_generator@kbin.social
      11·
      8 months ago

      Sure, in an ideal world they’d use Gripens instead of F-16s but in our actual world, where there are about 15 times as many F-16s as there are Gripens, availability matters more than fit.

      • Candelestine@lemmy.worldEnglish
        41·
        8 months ago

        Ideal and actual are drifting a little closer together after Sweden dangling their recent offer.

        Ukraine can only work with so many F-16s, if we somehow gave them 50,000, you would not see large wings of them flying Ukrainian skies, because the planes and pilots just aren’t enough. There’s a whole infrastructure around them that is completely necessary and that takes years to build up.

        So, don’t get me wrong. F-16s are great and I’m glad they’re going, but they are not a viable solution to Ukrainian problems. They’ll help some. The Grippen could be an actual solution, even in fairly small numbers due to its highly unique capabilities.

    • anachronist@midwest.socialEnglish
      2·
      8 months ago

      I think they need Vipers for SEAD. Gripens may be able to mount HARMs but effective SEAD is way more than just a missile. During Gulf War 1 they had to use phantoms and intruders for SEAD because vipers and hornets couldn’t support the mission yet.

      • Ooops@kbin.social
        5·
        8 months ago

        If they landed (in a non-emergency) in NATO countries and more importantly took off from there, then that country would obviously be an active participant in the war. Also voiding NATO Article 5 protection because you can’t claim to be attacked when you voluntarily joined the fight.

          • Ooops@kbin.social
            1·
            8 months ago

            And you do realize that nobody gives a shit about Russian bullshit claims in comparison to actual international law? Which is indeed the reason nobody sends NATO soldiers to to fight in Ukraine as it wouldn’t be some none-sensical claim then but reality.

              • Ooops@kbin.social
                1·
                8 months ago

                Are you seriously asking me to cite the law saying that attacking Russian troops as a non-involved party is an attack? I guess someone should start poking you with pan until you can show us the law that clearly defines being poked by pan as an attack.

                But jokes aside… international law (especially in regards to armed conflicts) is customary law going back hundreds of years. And even back then they weren’t stupid enough to need a defintion of attacking and defending. Because some people believe in humans to have a brain.

                An uninvolved country attacking Russian troops is an illegal act of war by definition, declaring the attack beforehand is still an act of war. It doesn’t matter if it’s in Ukraine, in Russia in free international waters or anywhere else. The actual only exception is when doing it by madate of the UN to restore peace.

                Are you really so dense to think NATO countries can attack other countries, then claim to be attacked when that country shoots back by pretending their attack was actually defense? Sorry, but back to above’s pan it is…

                • NAFO_69th_Sniffing_Brigade@mastodon.social
                  2·
                  8 months ago

                  @Ooops @Wilshire @Candelestine @bstix Ok let’s start at the end of this chaos. I Wonder with how many excuses somebody can come up with. If Ukrainians would be ⚽️-less like that, russia would already be in charge there. First thing: where is the UN mandate? Is the situation not severe enough? Is the organization useless, corrupted, can’t act even in life-threatening situations? Second: Budapest memorandum. Do the security guarantees for Ukraine only mean the delivery of weapons and no troops? /1

  • bigFab@lemmy.world
    67·
    8 months ago

    This made me laugh. Slap on the face for those who believe the west want the conflict to really end.

    • Ooops@kbin.social
      32·
      8 months ago

      You also make me laugh. For you are so drunk on hating the west that you can’t even fathom (or care to look up) that these are their actual air force with the first replacements coming in only beginning this year.

      Sure, all these stupid Westerners not giving their armies away is really despicable… if you are an idiot.