Simon Clark had a pretty good nuanced video on recycling and goes over plastics recycling in the latter parts of the video https://youtu.be/iOtrvBdRx8I
TL;DW Consider the environmental impact of systems over materials, most plastic doesn’t get recycled but some types of plastic are highly recyclable, existing plastic is undervalued, reduce > reuse > recycle.
PET bottle recycling is the only part of plastics recycling that actually works. Making sure the bottle caps are also correctly returned to recycling plants is a good goal. Also it makes picking up litter a little easier, because now you only need to pick up one thing instead of two.
Btw, this is why clothing/bags/… made out of recycled plastic bottles is actually a terrible idea, because once the PET is out of the bottle recycling stream it is permanently removed from this recycling loop and new PET needs to be produced to compensate.
We just need thousands more little steps. It all adds up. Like the whole plastic straws debacle. While mocked, it’s one more little step.
Yeah, the big problem is that each of these steps takes monumental effort while yielding only very little result.
At the current pace, new areas of plastic waste generation are added much faster than old areas are removed.
While we were busy banning plastic straws and plastic bags and stuck the cap onto the bottle, the plastic garbage production industry added thousands new types of unrecyclable products.
I don’t disagree.
I don’t know what % of plastic the cap comprises in a plastic bottle but I bet its double digits. So annoying as it is to use, attaching the cap to the bottle does make sense for recycling. It also lessens litter.
But it needs to be paired up with a deposit refund scheme. Lots of countries do this already and encourages circular economies - the soft drinks companies purchasing recycle material to reuse. I bet those schemes measured a significant jump in recovered plastic when virtually all the caps come back with the bottles.
Not only that, but the plastic in the cap is actually better recyclable one.
Annoying? Am I the only one who thinks it’s more convenient? The cap cannot fall, you can open it one handed, you cannot lose the cap…
from what i can tell it’s like half a percent of a percent of people who give a singular thought to it beyond “oh they changed it”
Lots of nestle simps in this threat
And they also force people to buy plastic bottles? That is so mean.
In a lot of places, yes. If that’s your only way to get water, you will be getting it from a bottle. Water, you know, is important to day-to-day life.
Thanks for explaining, I was worried this was a band aid mesure which didn’t solve to root cause. /s
The root problem is that plastic can be recycled but many countries to not motivate their populations to recycle, nor their industries to use reusable containers or to purchase recycled materials and create circular economies. In countries that do have deposit return schemes, reuse & recycling rates are far higher. I see attaching the cap to the bottle as way to squeeze a little more % out of those schemes.
while technically true it’s not accurate, the real reason to attach the cap is simply that we don’t fucking want bottlecaps strewn about everywhere.
I was interested in that whole ecoli eating plastic and producing 95% acetaminophen from it by mass. Maybe we can stop a lot of the plastic from water/soda bottles and just medicate ourselves till our livers shit themselves out our assholes.
That’s an EU regulation, not a corporate measure. And it has drastically decreased the amount of littered bottle caps, so a good thing.
I was interested in that whole ecoli eating plastic and producing 95% acetaminophen from it by mass. Maybe we can stop a lot of the plastic from water/soda bottles and just medicate ourselves till our livers shit themselves out our assholes.
Also it means recycle schemes get a % boost because a lot more bottles come back for recycling with their caps. I wouldn’t be surprised if the cap is 10-20% of the total plastic in a bottle so caps were missing then that’s wasted opportunity.
I remember as a kid when ring pulls on case used to detach and that’s the same thing too. I remember my dad metal detecting on the beach and he’d recover dozens of ringpulls because people just tossed them.
Littered bottle caps was a problem? Anyway, I hope they do cigarette filters next.
The caps was a problem yes. Not just littering, but also in sorting for recycling, where they’d often end up in the wrong place.
It obviously depends on where and how it’s done, but the thing I’ve heard is that due to (the lack of) weight and size the bottle caps would end up in the paper badges, which would ruin the paper from being recycled. It’s better if it follows the bottle. PET bottles (including caps) are shredded, washed and used for new bottles.
Same thing happened to the pull tabs on aluminium cans. Those used to be separate too.
I really like the can tabs. The plastic bottle caps annoy me because they make it harder to screw the cap back on. It needs a bit more innovation in my mind.
That’s an EU regulation, not a corporate measure. And it has drastically decreased the amount of littered bottle caps, so a good thing.
you should only be allowed to buy cigarettes if you can account for all your ciggy butts or pick-up an equal amount.
In Australia they have something called “report a tosser” people who are proven to have littered anything from cigarette buds to plastic bottles and more will be fined to hell and back.
Imagine the power of combining this tosser initiative with the revenue sharing aspect of New York’s vehicle idling program. Save the planet and get paid all at the same time.
Do like Japan with ammunition. You have to turn in your spent cases to buy more.
exactly where i got the idea :D
Those float in the sea, we don’t want that iiuc. Is a different plastic too, way more valuable from a recycling perspective (in Argentina hospitals used to collect caps to melt and make toys for childrens)
It works by applied statistics.
When you littered before - with the old cap - you’d have two pieces of plastic, now they are connected and it’s only one piece.
I’m only mildy annoyed by the new lids and got used to them, but it’s the bottle cap regulation is one of those that’s purely better for statistics.
It reduces littering by bottles to around half, just because we count the pieces differently now.
Maybe we should better just start taxing by the amount of plastic used in food packaging, as a lot of the packages get bigger and bigger just to display the contents more visibility.
It reduces littering by bottles to around half, just because we count the pieces differently now.
Beyond the statistics, collecting bottles seems easier than collecting bottle caps. Since people can’t stop tossing their trash in the street, at least it makes it easier for people that clean up to get them.
In many countries people collect their own bottles because there is a refundable tax on the container. Here in Ireland it’s 15c, i.e. a can of coke might be €1 but you’ll be charged €1.15. So it motivates people to take the empties back to a supermarket and receive a refund chit. It also motivates homeless people to pick up bottles & cans that people toss, so that too.
I get what you’re trying to say about homeless people, and there are many people reliant on collecting plastic bottles in Germany too, but motivation in that context sounds a tad off imo
An EU regulation that was heavily lobbied for by Coca Cola.
it costs coca cola more to produce those attached caps than not, are you saying coca cola was pushing for saving the environment? lol
It’s an EU regulation meant to battle bottle caps being a major problem for marine wild life, where bigger sea mammals and fish swallow them and suffocate from it. Why are you lobbying for mega corporations willingly and for free? Did you hit your head as child one time too many?
Can you show a link that supports that? Because I distinctly recall these companies opposing this measure.
He can’t because it’s not true.
This is a EU regulation and it’s a good one.
The only thing I can find in this direction is a letter from beverage companies (including coca cola) opposing these measures. But that’s based on a very shallow google search, so take it with a grain of salt. Where can I find info about what coca cola lobbied for or against?
Really? I never heard that before. What would they care about how their caps are? I can’t see it having any impact on them at all. A lot of people got pissed about it when Coca Cola was one of the first to change the caps in line with the regulation, so if anything it hurt Coca Cola.
Also even though large corporations are almost always totally evil, it’s not impossible for them to do something good as well. Probably not for the right reasons, but still, one thing doesn’t exclude the other.
It perpetuates the myth of recycling and puts the onus on the consumer and state to recycle instead of the corporations to stop using containers that pollute the environment, will be in the environment for decades without breaking down, and is likely causing yet unknown harm in our bodies since plastic is inside all of us now.
The first of the “3 R’s” is reduce but instead of that being the focus because it hurts their bottom line, they prop up recycling and sell the lie that we can keep living as is if we just recycle more and get better at recycling.
My guess - somebody at coca-cola figured out the cap attachment system and they patented it, but had no real plan. Then someone had the idea to lobby the EU to make it a requirement. They can sell it because it will reduce litter to some extent and improve the beverage industry’s reputation. But more importantly, coca-cola not already has their manufacturing systems in place to produce these bottle caps. Other bottle manufacturers must now play catch up, constraining the supply of bottles available for EU beverage sales. Now their competitors are scrambling to update their own bottles, which will increase their costs and might delay shipments, lending coca-cola market share. And smaller competitors who outsource their bottling might be forced out of the market entirely if the company they contract with to manufacture their bottles can’t or won’t comply with this regulation.
No idea why they’d want those tethered caps. My speculation (and that’s 100% unfounded, so take it as you will) is that they are lobbying for something simple and cheap (tethered caps, plastic straws, etc), to blind people from the real environmental issues that are far more costly to tackle. Kind of like the plastic recycle logo, which is a total scam, but makes people feel good enough to not further question the big corps’ recycling practices.
Attached cap prevents it from becoming a macroplastic
I think the cap thing is more about littering because in those countries people litter only the cap for some reason?
When cleaning up beaches and the like, those caps are the litter they found the most.
People lost them or didn’t bother to pick them up because they are so small. Unlike with the bottles themselves.
Since they switched to the new caps, the amount of caps found has decreased significantly.
So yes, they work. It is all based on data.
Ofc it is, but stupid fucks have to complain about mundane shit
I’m only complaining about all the people that apparently regularly lost bottle caps. I don’t think that has happened to me ever… Not the end of the world and if it reduces litter I’ll deal with it but I curse these people every time one of the new caps is being annoying to screw back on.
Minority opinion, but I like those style caps. I like that I dont have to hold the cap. It’s much easier on the go.
Yeah I got used to them fairly quickly when visiting Europe recently. At first it was a bit annoying - kinda in the way when drinking and harder to twist back on properly. But after a few days you get the hang of it, and in some ways I prefer that style now.
Or when it hits your nose.
OP is a 2 day old account. If you haven’t figured it out yet, there is a massive anti-progress astroturfing campaign all over the Internet, and it’s little shit like this which quietly switches people into cynical brain rot. Memes are bumper sticker politics, and you should always be skeptical of them when they are pushing any narrative.
Also, the caps separated from the bottle fall through dinky cracks easier, like street drain covers) and get lost easier (or drop out of the bottom of the bin easier, etc.), being attached to the large bottle makes that more difficult to occur.
The bottle has a deposit on it, the cap doesn’t
Not true for most EU countries.
True for all Euro places that I have been to that had deposits
Edit: apparently not, i take everything back
Not in Belgium, they’ve been dragging their feet for years on this by now.
not Italy
I’m not sure then. Maybe because people litter the cap right when they open it, but end up carrying the partially full drink with them?
true here in germany
Not sure if this applied universally, but I remember for years and years the common knowledge was that plastic caps are unrecyclable for some reason, and there used to be separate bins to toss them at recycling centers. That’s no longer the case, so keeping the cap connected to the bottle is one way to demonstrate that they should be recycled together.
(By “recycled” I mean most likely shipped to Southeast Asia to then most likely just find their way into the ocean)
(By “recycled” I mean most likely shipped to Southeast Asia to then most likely just find their way into the ocean)
You would be wrong; PET bottles are mostly actually recycled, because it recycles very well (also, why would places go to the effort of setting up a deposit/return scheme for something they aren’t actually recycling? Just throw it in the blue bag with all the other plastic that doesn’t actually get recycled)
I think the kind of plastic used in bottles is one of very few that actually are profitable to recycle. PET, I think. This is actually something recycling companies want. Most other plastic is just burned or shipped somewhere.
PET is so hilariously easy to recycle that you can literally just clean out bottles and put them in a little jig that cuts it into strips and feeds it into a 3d printer, it’s not peak quality or anything but it totally works.
IIRC the reason most caps used to be unrecyclable (many still are) is that they had a liner in them made of a different material. Because such caps were composite materials (using different types of plastic for the liner and the cap), they would make an impure product if recycled. The same problem applies if the cap and bottle are different types of plastic, which used to be more common.
I remember they used to collect bottle caps to donate to charities that used it to make stuff for dogs and stuff
This is why I stopped recycling and put everything in the trash.
For one I was so sad when I found out what a scam it is that such a small amount of stuff is actually recycled and especially plastic never was actually planned to be recycled.
Two, I’d rather most of the plastic end up in our own landfill than to be shipped overseas into someone else’s or just end up in the ocean. We deserve to poison our own land thanks to our politicians not holding corporations to account.
I like the convenience of not losing the cap
Easier to walk around with an open bottle too since you don’t have to hold the cap or put it into your pocket
Conspiracy theory of mine - I’m European, so not sure if valid for the other side of the pond, but there was a massive campaign here to recycle the bottle caps by donating them for the creation of incubators for premature births. The local authorities placed massive donation boxes shaped like a heart and they were getting filled constantly.
Here’s the theory: When the campaign started getting up to speed, they started attaching the bottle caps to the bottle, because, I strongly believe, that out there, there is an absolute evil cunt who only feels something when a baby dies, so he wants fewer donated caps, because deep inside he knows people don’t care enough to snap the cap off.
Can incubators not be made out of PET? why not accept and recycle the whole bottle?
I’ve seen one if these, so that is what they are for!
Cynicism, on the other hand - that’s always good.
I end up dribbling because the lid gets in my way, but it’s fine because I’m helping to offset the pollution caused by a billionaire’s private jet.
“Hello fellow citizens! Did you know that rich people go everywhere with private jets? Maybe you should just choose the comfortable route, and throw away your cola bottle on the spot.”
I remember when cans used to have tabs that tore off. These were changed to the current model, where the tab stays attached after the can is opened.
People complained that they couldn’t drink properly with the new tab design. I guess they either figured it out, died, started using a glass, or gave up drinks in cans completely, since I haven’t heard this complaint in decades.
Anyway, I hope you figure it out, comrade! Good luck!
If you keep pushing it further open it has a detent that will hold it open far enough that even my big nose won’t touch it… It’s an amazing design, better than a screw cap in every way. Well, at least the properly designed ones.
Or … you can just hold the cap to a side instead of directly on your nose …
Yeah, I know, but that doesn’t lend itself to comments that get upvotes, and I’m a slag for it.
That last sentence is pulling a whole lot of weight there, there are so many bad implementations out there it’s just stupid.
Also why the hell does this extend to all bottles, what is the point of a milk carton having this mandatory. (Pure coincidence, but most milk packaging I’ve come across after the change falls in the ‘bad implementation’ category)
Why would it make sense to manufacture different types of caps when the largest market is now the attached ones?
Because they’re very different bottles (the cap on the milk I’m talking about combines the seal with the cap)
Sometimes they’re harder to close
Even worse, “it’s mildly annoying, so I don’t wanna!” Ofc would be better if people didn’t throw em away at all, But alas
