“The only art form that Americans have invented, that will commend us down through the years to posterity, is a music born primarily in a community that has the historical memory of being unfree is a supposedly free land” - Ken Burns
This scenario has happened so many zillion times it’s not the least bit astounding - something becomes popular with a group of people, then another group and another, in spite of some people hating it or sometimes because of that, and the business world figures out how to make money off it.
Take country music, for example, and all the black parents who were afraid of it, but the black kids who loved it. /s
The trend is fetishizing black culture; music is just a part of that.
or, you know, black culture has been very prolific and makes good art so it appeals to a lot of people. I think calling it fetishizing is a bit insulting to the counter itself; as if it doesn’t have its own merit.
dominating the art scene had been historically true of a lot of minorities in various countries. I guess art is one thing you can’t take away from people easily.
I think it is fetishizing when you systemically oppress black people but coopt their art.
that’s appropriation, and black people themselves are fetishized, but I don’t know if that’s appropriate to say about the culture.
Yeah my point is that thinking of it as fetishizing black culture is a very narrow view of a much more universal human behavior, where people like whatever they like without bothering to filter it by who found out about it first, and business people maks a buck out of any and every trend no matter where it came from.
Two things can be true.
What you’re saying just isn’t true, though, or at least doesn’t explain the sheer fascination of contemporary white americans with mimicking every aspect of black culture
People have enjoyed mimicking each other the human race began. Things that originate in one culture often have broad appeal [shrug]. I wouldn’t call it “sheer fascination” but whatever.
Jazz, Rock, Disco, and Rap, at minimum.
and because of rock, we now have death metal. thanks african americans!
edit: for people who are interested: https://musicmap.info/
eeeeeeeh.
I think death/tech death is where the blues influence starts being more vestigial, and it starts borrowing more from classical. Even Polka (what is a blastbeat but a fast polka beat?) Are the diminished scales really from blues? Do the blues musicians play straight 32nd notes the way classical musicians do?
From an evolutionary standpoint, it definately does, since blues to rock to sabbath to metal, but death metal onwards really feels distinct. Especially symphonic.
yea. classical started getting folded back in to the metal music with NWOBHM. a lot of the bands i grew up listening to (cannibal, morbid, deicide) grew up listening to stuff like maiden, priest, venom etc, which i can’t stand oddly enough.
I call that a healthy cultural mix! 🤘😁🤘
stuff like maiden, priest, venom etc, which i can’t stand oddly enough.
first time you hear possessed seven churches hello you can’t go back with your Iron Maiden
I’m not really a metal head and I’d never heard of Possessed / Seven Churches so I found it and gave it a listen.
My honest opinion is…meh. Musically it’s an interesting track, arguably better than some Iron Maiden songs, but the vocals are the same muddy mess that ruins so many other metal bands.
If you listen to Seven Churches and then immediately play “Aces High” or “Run to the Hills” you will hear exactly what I’m talking about. It boils down to this; Jeff Becerra seems to love being buried in the music so he can growl out undecipherable lyrics while Bruce Dickinson is conveying at least as much vocal power while standing out from the music and being clear enough that you can hear the message.
It’s just my opinion of course and honestly this is the same problem I’ve had with nearly every American Death Metal band. I don’t know why most of them even bother having a vocalist as they are functionally useless.
Rock out to whatever moves ya’ but I definitely wouldn’t rank Possessed ahead of Iron Maiden.
Ahh folk metal, that can be a fun genre of music! The one you linked isn’t too bad but if you like it a bit…eastern…you may want to check out “The HU”.
Click the link first.
spoiler
I haven’t actually listened to possessed, so I can’t comment. I just liked that guy’s statement of “I like stuff heavier than maiden” and it made me think of the Luc Lemay interview.
gorguts–loved none so vile but not so much the one immediately after.
he’s wearing a deathspell omega shirt–fun fact, their singer is a big name in NSBM
IDK, Deathspell are more famous for being prog or avant garde or something. I’m pretty sure (but not 100% certain) that Luc is not a nazi, he does a lot of stuff about middle eastern and asian history
Funk, Blues, R&B, Reggae, Bebop, Swing…
Dubstep has strong roots to Jamacian Dub. https://youtu.be/NUOeHoLCisw. Except for the dub guys, are actual wizards making all of their effects with analog technology.
Also reggea and dancehall come from Jamaica as well, incredible such a small country having so much influence.
such a small country
don’t forget ska, which is wide ranging enough to have radio bands, but there’s also a satanic ska band
Ska punk is my absolute favourite genre of music. Streetlight Manifesto, Less Than Jake, Faintest Idea, Mad Caddies, and the Suicide Machines are all bands I love, to name a few.
what’s your most recent favorite album?
Right now, it’s Ska Dream by Jeff Rosenstock, and by extension its sister album No Dream. I’m also really looking forward to Streetlight’s next album The Place Behind The Stars, as the few songs they’ve let us hear from it are already incredible despite not being entirely finished.
nice, thanks for the recommendation!
Rock Steady too
Blues?
It’s assumed here that rock is derived from blues
EDIT : Blues is blues, which is obviously black.
Blues is the plural of blue which is a different color from black according to modern color theory
Blues is the plural of blue which is a different color from black according to modern color theory
Big if true
Rock had a whooole lot of influences including white ones.
cite reference
How much time do you have, ha?
This is one of the most well researched pieces of work I’ve ever come across. Like somebody’s PhD dissertation. A ten year project for the author. I can’t recommend it enough.
So just to throw some names out there of white people who significantly influenced rock music: Johnny Otis, Bob Wills, Cosimo Matassa.
Seriously, check out this podcast you’re interested in this stuff. I think it’s on other platforms if you don’t have Spotify.
Techno came from black kids on Detroit listening to Kraftwerk and then exporting that sound back to Germany
They lived in Belleville, but no one knows where that is.
I do, it’s in long island.
is this a meme about race, or a racist meme?
About race fetishism and commercial exploitation, I believe
Punk
The band known as “death”
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL71xICgSKYzlEYreXb96htKm8sacZIa-0
I don’t necessarily agree that they “invented” punk but Bad Brains definitely invented hardcore.
I was at the Magic Stick show in Detroit for the doc. I used to live down the street.
Most of Elvis early hits were ripoffs of black music
I feel like the roots of basically all western mudic today are African American, if you consider techno to have come from hiphop/r&b and punk rock.
i was told in “music appreciation” class in college that, even though percussion has been around for ages, anything with a “beat” can be traced back to africans. rock n’ roll got big because it was one of the first new things available through the radio, and kids at the time were sick of their parents’ stuffy classical music
In Germany, we differentiate E- and U-Musik. E (Ernst) means “serious” and is classical music and stuff. U (Unterhaltung) = entertainment and is everything African American inspired (Jazz, Rock, Pop, hip hop, …). This difference basically exists to devalue everything that isn’t central European in origin
Yeah… Mozart’s compositions definetly are only serious and not for entertainment at all. Stuff like… checks notes “Leck mich im Arsch” or the original text of “Bona Nox”. /s
Adam Neely has a good video on this. Music is constantly judged on how well it conforms to “the harmonic style of 18th century European musicians”
y’all should stop differentiating them
True and it’s far less common nowadays I think. I haven’t heart it for a while. I remember in school our teacher discussed it critically but not from a CRT perspective but more like “some classical music is quite danceable and some blues can get quite serious”, not “this is a eurocentric concept and we should stop it”
Except for traditional Folk from various European locations. I think this still counts as “Western Music”, even if it isn’t that popular.
If you consider the Western World to be purely Northern America, then I think you’re right, since Native American tribes are normally not considered Western.
Imo, the best music comes from a mix of various cultures, I’m a huge fan of Folk Rock/Metal. (Rock and thus Metal obviously coming from Blues).
Definitly true and fair point, yes i meant pop music in western countries. Also still a lot of new classical music being released. I would be more right if i had said ‘almost all genres of western pop music have Afro-American roots’.
All good, I didn’t want to accuse you of being wrong or anything. I just like to think of exceptions in cases like that. And I learned a few things on the way :)
I didn’t feel accused, so all good :)
That’s the first time I have heard techno coming from hiphop and
technopunk rock. I thought it was more disco (which also has African American roots of course) and Krautrock etc.Probably has multiple roots that came together, i believe the name techno has something to do with there being new (tech) instruments and I afaik the drummachines came from hip hop because rock had real drummers but techno also used analog synthesisers in their early days which I guess were not from hip hop but from punk. Disco must had an influence as well, but I am really no expert.
