At some point I have to start wondering if Putin pays these sorts of people.
Translating .ml rules as they’re actually enforced:
- Don’t criticise Russia, China, or Hamas.
- Don’t criticise ML, LG, HB.
Those rules are enforced regardless of the piece of criticism being valid or invalid.
The thread the comment was in. Seemed like a very relevant question.
https://lemmy.world/post/21619412
Note that dessalines isn’t even a moderator of the community, but a lemmy.ml instance admin. Instance rule 1 is related to bigotry, so according to Lemmy dev dessalines, it’s bigoted to ask the russian population if they are oppressed or support their country invading ukraine.
That’s mod rule 1. Admin rule #1 is “Don’t get visited by the KGB”.
Maybe we shouldn’t hang out on servers where Russia has jurisdiction.
Wait are you exaggerating/joking or is ML literally hosted in Russia?
The domain is registered in Mali, hence .ml. Not sure where Dessalines and Nutomic are from.
I thought ML was Marxist Leninist
No, it stands for Mali. Marxist-Leninist is just a happy coincidence for them.
TIL
I like it here on lemmy. But people like this being main devs leaves sour taste to it
I think a lot of people are going to switch to piefed once that gets more fleshed out. It federates with all lemmy but has a different and more open dev team working on it. They already have a bunch of cool features lemmy is currently lacking.
Piefed looks like an interesting project for sure. I don’t know much about it though - are they getting close to feature parity with Lemmy?
In many ways they already are ahead. The front end is a bit wonky though, and some of the foundational features are still catching up (it’s fully functioning though).
For one thing, they have “categories” of communities, and for another I can block all users from any instance I choose - though there is really no easy way to accomplish that while still on Lemmy proper.
But like when you upvote something, later it remembers that but won’t show you the color. The interface is really pretty though, and solves several of the issues I had with Lemmy, like another one is that you can turn on viewing or both the upvote and separate downvote counts, which for Lemmy iirc you can only see that for comments, but for posts that only shows on the mobile site yet not on the desktop for some reason.
The PieFed devs are super responsive, quite extraordinary so imho. It’s like they care or something (uh… cause they do, ofc!:-).
So especially since Lemmy is not perfect either, check out both Mbin and PieFed and just see them in action without an account, just for the fun of it.:-)
There’s no way Python and Flask are going to scale as well as Rust. It’s going to require more hardware to run and be able to handle fewer users.
The DB is all that matters. Python can scale very well through parallelization. So long as one doesn’t restrict themselves to one process, there’s really little chokepoint.
Nope… CPU and memory usage matter as well… if they get exhausted, you get throttling. This also has an impact on server-costs… Why run 2 instances of something that serves 4k requests/second over one instance that serves 9k/s (just an over-exaggerating example)
That’s why I say if you don’t restrict to single process. As to why something which might be slightly more inefficient (it’s not going to be that much), it’s because of ease of development and pool of potential developers to help you with it.
I think a lot of people are going to switch to piefed
The big problem is that it isn’t really possible for instances to switch from Lemmy to PieFed, or any other ActivityPub software.
Once a Piefed instance is mature enough, I could consider asking a few communities I mod if they would be okay to migrate to it.
[email protected] for instance doesn’t really need to be able to edit past posts, and we already moved from LW to lemm.ee. Moving again to another instance wouldn’t be that different.
That’s a highly specific comm though and most instances/comms would not be okay losing the history. You also inevitably stunt growth and lose some users during such a migration. It would be much better if ActivityPub allowed an instance to change its underlying representation, while keeping all the users and post and data but unfortunately this is basically impossible.
I would move [email protected] and [email protected] too, and I guess the people would still be okay.
We created those communities here from scratch. What matters is the incoming content and discussions, archived threads are good for information but not much more.
We have no content on any community here older than 1 year and a half except the ones on lemmy.ml, are those more popular than the LW, SJW or mander.xyz ones?
Yeah unfortunately it’s not quite ready for mainstream yet. I’ve noticed over the last several days that I’ve been using it a bunch of small UI things that would really frustrate someone without a high level of tolerance to such. e.g. you get a notification telling you that you have a message, you click it, but there’s no message; so you do a control-F to try to find it… nope, still no message; next you have to hunt through the entire page for every “expansion block” and “Continue thread” (which takes you to another page) and those “auto-collapse” (based on comment threshold), and I disabled “auto-hide” but surely that might really be a problem if there’s a Notification for something that becomes impossible to see later without changing your configuration settings.
For extremely basic things it’s fine… mostly. Just never edit your messages and someone will be fine. I say that b/c you can’t edit comments in-line in the page where they are at, and once you are done editing one, it doesn’t take you back to it but rather to the OP thread instead. Whereupon again you have to hunt for your comment all over again as mentioned above. Which is especially annoying when you have to do it multiple times, b/c there is no Preview feature to let you know what is coming after you submit it - did you insert a space between your [alttext] (link here)? did you mess up your
"quoting"rules? does an image not render?
(the above on purpose:-)
On the other hand, they can allow YouTube embeds without having to wonder what is on the other side of that sus-looking link and click and leave the page. And personal instance blocks - that actually work - and categories, and like it will tell you, for every comment, both the time something was posted and the time it was last edited, woot!:-) There’s just a ton of fantastic features, more so than Lemmy in many ways, and yet at the same time less too - if that makes any sense at all.
But then again, more people know how to code in Python, so I hope it will catch up soon:-). That might even be what we’re seeing now - the core UI needs to be not monkeyed around with by a bunch of people all working at cross-purposes, but then all these nice little additions could each be someone’s side project? But they need to get the core working too.
By “a lot” I’m guessing you mean a steady and eventually declining population of a few thousand monthly users?
We don’t.have a lot of users, even if everyone switches they won’t get a lot of users.
Now i recall why there’s a push against migrating to lemmy when reddit blackout happened. I thought it doesn’t really matter, turns out they’re right.
It would be much better if more servers actively defederated or limited their server, that way the things they say and do would have less effect on the other servers that aren’t affiliated with them.
Yeah, it was and is the major issue with lemmy I think.
On the other hand, it’s an open source project amd there are likely other contributors that don’t agree with them ideologically. And as long as you don’t interact with the .ml instance it should not effect you.
There will be assholes everywhere.
It honestly makes me concerned about the broader security risks of using lemmy. There’s a lot of opportunity for them to target users they don’t like by serving them malicious content via lemmy.ml, and they have shown nothing to indicate that they are above this kind of thing imo.
There is a way to block an instance, no? Or maybe I don’t understand what you mean…
Not really. Well, instance admins can defederate from it, but as a normal user you have a pitifully small list of all not easy choices. First, a couple apps like Sync and Connect can (but for them I don’t know if they would block e.g. images from there); second is move to PieFed or Mbin (I moved to PieFed myself, but could not find this post there so had to come back to my previous account, as an alt now I guess, to be able to reply here - so it’s got issues); third is move to one of only 3 tiny instances that I’ve ever heard of that have blocked it; fourth is spin up your own instance, and defederate from them. The long version.
Edit: oh, there is a basic Lemmy “instance block”, which blocks only communities on those instances - but not users, their posts, replies, votes, etc., and even that much was rolled back somewhere between 0.19.3 and 0.19.5 so that they can now send notifications to you. So it is very misleading named. The last one there is what almost caused me to leave the Fediverse entirely when I accidentally replied to one comment in ChapoTrapHouse and another somewhere in lemmygrad.ml. The replies to each kept coming in for WEEKS and WEEKS, long after I wanted it to end. The rule “remember the human” seemed to not apply to them.
Tankies gonna tank. Never question the orthodoxy in an echo bunker.
I feel like using Lemmy.ml here is cheating.
perhaps I should have posted in [email protected] but that sub is basically preaching to the choir
Still good to collect stuff there
You can cross-post it there, I feel like there is merit to having this get as much exposure as possible. Also [email protected] is another good one, it’s a bit smaller but still good place to share stuff like this.
The best reason to use MWoG is how much its existence upsets the tankies. Dessalines in particular is obviosly extremely fragile.
Pick whatever instance you find first, they said. It doesn’t really matter which one, you can participate all over lemmy, they said.
Now every time i post a comment, people automatically assume I’m pro Russia and a tankie on account of having an account on lemmy.ml
This sucks. I can’t believe I’m gonna have to migrate instances to be taken seriously on discussions.
Remember in the early days of the Fediverse when people said it was all about “freeze peach”? Yeah that was not good. Not only is it wrong and would disappoint and piss off a lot of people when they learn about defederation and that you can still get banned, but it also attracts a lot of extremely rotten people to the platform. Remember exploding-heads? Yeah that was a side effect of that lie to try and promote the Fediverse.
Don’t migrate because of the assumers; migrate to not subject yourself to an incompetent admin team.
sorry to hear that. My first account was on ML too.
Yeah same. I moved after seeing too many words being censored like removed.
I was flabbergasted when I found out the word Chicken was sometimes censored. It would put removeden. Really saved me from those nuggets of hurtful baby hens.
I heard that the filter used to be hardcoded and there was a lot of controversy because the devs refused to remove it or allow it to be customized but they folded when people were willing to fork it to remove the limitation or remove it altogether.
We don’t believe you, you tankie vatnik.
/s obviously.
FYI, just making a new user on a different instance isn’t a big deal. Guess why there’s a “3” in my user name. Come to think of it, my first account was on lemmy.ml too, although the main reason why I moved at that time was because I forgot the password.
I probably would’ve signed up at lemmy.ml if they hadn’t closed registrations in the Reddit migration, very glad I didn’t though from what has happened there. I signed up to Lemmy.world instead, and even though it is problematic in many ways at least the Admins there aren’t trigger happy power tripping bastards, trying to promote their pro-russia tankie shit.
See it in a positive way: now you can carefully choose an instance that you like compared to your previous account
Also, this must be my 10th alt. It takes a few minutes to export/import the settings and that’s it
People are dumb everywhere. You’re not really wondering about that hm? 😉 I wouldn’t migrate because of that. Quite the contrary, the dumdums sort themselves out this way, saves a lot of time.
But what you also have to consider, migrating instances sends a signal. Its the same as people who stopped using twitter because of musk. When you continue using something you make it look like you font really care, so migrating your account is a good way to tell the admins that you dislike their policies.
While you’re totally right regarding twitter, i can’t say the same for those instances. I’m not deep enough in the matter to allow myself an opinion. I just don’t know about any politics about any instance. If there is, you’re totally right then too. Leaving is the best bet. If I’d knew my instance would wanna push a certain narrative, even if it’d be congruent with mine, I’d leave.
The Main Problem is, that the Admins are straight up tankies. They also have no problems banning you from all the communitys they moderate if you say something they don’t like
I just have to take your word for it, because I don’t follow the meta-politics on Lemmy. I’m just a user :)
You should peruse their modlog a bit and see how many people are banned for it, instead of just taking their word for it. That’s the benefit of Lemmy or other platforms, modlog is public.
If you’re interested in it you can take a quick roundtrip about this community and you will see quite some examples of the Lemmy.ml Admins being tankies.
Tankies haven’t learned that ignoring things to reduce visibility tend to be more effective censorship than creating a streisand effect.
That’s how the west learnt to do deal with it. Manipulate it in the backend, not the front, and if caught, blame it on a bug.
I legit would not be surprised if Dessalines takes money from some unsavory people to operate .ml as a kind of information war training ground.
User donations are certainly not generating him any real cash flow.
I’d be surprised if Lemmy.ml, lemmygrad.ml, and Hexbear don’t get funding from the Kremlin/CCP
Ye that’s a ptb
I feel like we need something along the lines of “ML - Yes, that’s lemmy.ml” added to the acronym list. Or maybe “WKB - Well known bastards”?
deleted by creator
What’s rule 1 anyway? I don’t want to wade into that cesspool to find out?
Rule 1 is whatever they want it to be. They don’t moderate anything in good faith at ml.
much like codes of conduct I feel like it’s a false flag to handwave bad moderation using questionable interpretations of subjective terminology.
instance rule 1 is no bigotry.
Since dessalines is not a mod but an instance admin I assume that’s the justification for the removal.
“Open-ended question”
Edit: Why you two downvoting this? I literally just quoted the rule to answer their question. lol
I think the instance reason was why it was removed. Otherwise that would be extremely weird enforcement of open ended questions rule. Enforcing it on a random comment, while the original post itself is a single yes/no question…
I could see a strong argument for personal safety around such a question (potential for self-incrimination and going through windows) but bigotry is a head scratcher.
Serious question… how?
Is everything on Lemmy traceable back to the source?
If it’s networked, it’s traceable.
I’m using a VPN. How would that work?
VPNs didn’t make things untraceable at all. That’s not what they are for. They are just a method for encrypting traffic between two networks that have connectivity to the public Internet. Traffic from your machine to the VPN entrypoint gets routed just like any other network traffic. A relatively passive MitM can readily see where packets are going to/arriving from based upon the headers.
ips are probably logged somewhere between here and there
To be fair, the first part of the sentence kinda sounds like an accusation against Russians. However, it isn’t something i would consider worthy to be deleted.
I remember when the Ukraine war started and in the comments of one of the first reddit posts were full of Russian people saying how they hated it and they just wanted peace. Nowadays I can’t remember the last time I saw someone who is Russian on reddit or Lemmy really.
ok liberal
On the one hand, a quick check of the author’s posts shows that he is just an obvious pro-NATO shill and his question was in bad faith, so Dessalines did nothing wrong by kicking him out.
On the other hand, this thread could have led to an insightful discussion that would have been interesting to read, so it’s a shame that it was removed.
In the very beginning, .ml had the unique vibe of a truly decentralized international community with thousands of people from all over the world with different worldviews, leading to fiery and thought-provoking discussions in threads. Unfortunately, it is now actively turning into a hexbear/grad style far-left echo chamber.
This may be a controversial opinion, but I think instances and communities should just ban people for acting in bad faith. There’s very little actual insightful discussion that you can have without someone trying to just win some unilateral debate with some really obnoxious comments. I hate seeing people arguing and being rude all over the place.
I try my best to be the change I want to see in the world, but it’s really tough sometimes to try and stay positive and constructive when you’re just enduring endless personal insults
Very true and very well said.
Though multiple things can be true at once - if both OP was acting in bad faith (I didn’t look) and people get banned from Lemmy.ml at the drop of a hat, i.e. moderation is done in bad faith as well.
I get what you are saying - and yes, compassion is awesome - but also, look at the history of that instance and you’ll see what I mean. If they really have lost the faith then they could step down as moderator of that instance and allow someone else to take that burden. Or just shut it down entirely (that’s what the dmv.social instance did, when they felt like the pressure was too much). Not that I am advocating for either option (especially since the next person who replaces them would likely be actively worse at this point?), but just pointing out that after receiving the bad vibes, spreading them further is still a matter of choice.
![Lemmy Developer removes comment in [email protected] for asking Russians if they are being oppressed by their government and if they support the ukraine war.](https://lemmy.blahaj.zone/pictrs/image/420f4965-78c7-427f-b3e7-64eaa58b84e6.webp){kind=link}