Seriously it really grinds my gears that the Canadian government thinks that 16 years olds are mature and intelligent enough to drive a car, work a full-time job, pay taxes, apply for a passport, and are able to live independently on their own without a parent or guardian if they want to and get married with parent consent.

But when it comes to voting the Canadian thinks 16 year olds are not mature and intelligent enough to vote. Its completely ridiculous in my opinion.

  • ryan213
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    29
    arrow-down
    3
    ·
    2 months ago

    If you’re paying taxes, you should have a say in where it’s spent.

    • TrenGoblinOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      11
      arrow-down
      7
      ·
      2 months ago

      Exactly it’s completely fucking ridiculous that 16 years old are legally able to pay for taxes, drive a car. But can’t legally be allowed to vote until they are 18.

      A 16 year old and 18 year old both have the same level of maturity. So if 18 years old are allowed to vote then I think 16 year old should also legally be allowed to vote.

      • stokedcrf
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        11
        arrow-down
        4
        ·
        2 months ago

        To be fair, some 15 year olds are just as mature as some 19 year olds. Are you saying 15 year olds should be able to buy smokes and drink? In Canada a 16 year old cannot drive a car without another licensed driver sitting beside them as well, so that’s not a good comparison.

        Maybe 16 year olds should be tax-exempt until they are old enough to vote :)

        • TrenGoblinOP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          8
          ·
          edit-2
          2 months ago

          True a 16 year old can’t drive without a another valid driver’s license sitting beside them in Canada but it’s still does not change the fact that a 16 year old driving a car even with another licensed driver beside is still extremely dangerous because there is still that chance they could get in to a car accident and die.

          As far my opinion on if 15 year should be able to legally be allowed to smoke or drink. I think l that if a 15 year old understand the long term social ramifications of smoking and drinking and still chose to not care about the potential risk that can happen as result of them smoking or drinking then it’s morally okay for them to smoke or drink in my opinion.

          I believe everything to be morally neutral unless I am given a valid reason for it to be morally wrong.

          I do not get my morals from the law or from a religious book.

          • veee
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            6
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            2 months ago

            15 year olds should absolutely not be legally allowed to drink and smoke. Knowing the detriments of vices does not shield one from the immense peer pressure young people need to deal with. Not to mention that the long term financial burden of supporting sick or hospitalized people is on an older, ideally healthier, generation.

            • TrenGoblinOP
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              1
              arrow-down
              6
              ·
              2 months ago

              If you ideally want a healthier generation. it would be better if crigrites, alcohol and all recreational drugs are illegal in Canada so that we wouldn’t have to deal with the long-term financial burden of supporting sick or hospitalized people.

              And I think parents that overfeed their child with alot of food everyday are morally a bad person and should be put in prison for child abuse in my opinion because childern 13 and under do not know the long term social ramifications of obesity. They don’t know that they could potentially get a heart attack and die if they continue to stuff their face with food everyday.

              • m0darn
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                4
                arrow-down
                2
                ·
                2 months ago

                And I think parents that overfeed their child with alot of food everyday are morally a bad person and should be put in prison for child abuse

                I agreed that 16 year olds should be allowed to vote until I read this sentence. Congrats on poisoning your own well.

      • bionicjoey
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        2 months ago

        A 16 year old and 18 year old both have the same level of maturity

        Biologically this is not true. People’s brains are still in development until the mid-20s

        • TrenGoblinOP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          arrow-down
          3
          ·
          2 months ago

          Even still I don’t see any difference at all between a 16-year-old and a 18 year old. So they should have the right to vote in my opinion because 16 years old are already driving cars and paying for taxes in Canada.

  • ThrowawayPermanente@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    21
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    2 months ago

    I don’t think 16 year olds should really be driving cars, either. Most of them are irresponsible lunatics, in my experience. But they can learn to d’rive safely, and the earlier they start the faster they’ll learn. Ideally they would be doing so in a simulator for the first few years. We should probably handle politics the same way - teach teenagers about the political process and help them get experience reasoning about political problems but without exposing others to the consequences of their errors until they’re ready to fully participate.

    • TrenGoblinOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      6
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      2 months ago

      Well if you think 16 year shouldn’t legally be allowed to drive a car then at least you logically consistent.

    • m0darn
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      2 months ago

      I think 16 year olds should be legally allowed to drive with guardian supervision. I think they usually are able to.

      I think 16 year olds should be legally allowed to drink with guardian supervision. I think they usually are able to.

      I think 16 year olds should be legally allowed to smoke with guardian supervision. I think they usually are able to. 16 year olds can’t buy them, but parents could give them. I can only think of one situation where parents should facilitate their 16 year olds smoking (as part of a smoking cessation plan).

      I think that if a guardian attests that their 16 year old is ready to vote, they should be allowed to.

      • DerisionConsulting
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        2 months ago

        I think that if a guardian attests that their 16 year old is ready to vote, they should be allowed to.

        I feel that people who don’t agree with the child’s politics may not allow them to vote.

        • m0darn
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          2 months ago

          That’s a risk. Yeah I don’t really know why you’d need a parental attestation. Forget that part.

  • ILikeBoobies
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    19
    ·
    2 months ago

    Yeah I am fine with it

    When you get older you’ll realize how stupid people are so the age difference for voting is trivial

  • veee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    20
    arrow-down
    5
    ·
    2 months ago

    I think 18 is low enough. I don’t think most 16 year olds have enough life experience yet to make informed decisions about government and politics.

    • ivanafterall@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      11
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      2 months ago

      I’ll take that risk, having seen how most of the “wizened” people with life experience vote.

      • veee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        2 months ago

        Adults already fall prey to team politics, so it’s a bit of a weak argument—I know.

        I think it would still be interesting to get an official youth vote, even if it did not count, to quantify the issues as they see it.

        • hihellobyeoh@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          2 months ago

          This could be really good, they could have 2-4 years of actually showing up at the polling location, and even better for politicians, they would be able to see the data related to what the next voters are worried about, allowing them to change how they campaign… I’m starting to like this decision less.

    • TrenGoblinOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      arrow-down
      16
      ·
      edit-2
      2 months ago

      Well then I guess we can just agree to disagree because in my opinion I think most 16-year-old have enough life experience and are able to make informed decisions about the government and politics.

      And I also think that if a 16 year old commits a crime they should be charged as adult.

      • rdyoung@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        16
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        2 months ago

        I don’t know what circles you grew up in but in my entire life I’ve met only a handful of teenagers who not only know what the fuck is actually going on but care enough to do something about it. I interact regularly with college students at a fairly respected and prestigious University and most of them have no fucking idea what is going on in the world or what needs to happen to make changes, how complicated things actually are, etc.

        One main reason why under 18 shouldn’t vote is the concern that the adults around them will bully them into voting against their own beliefs and interests regardless of which side anyone may be on.

        I skimmed your history here and you sound like a kid who is feeling too big for their britches.

        • TrenGoblinOP
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          1
          arrow-down
          11
          ·
          edit-2
          2 months ago

          It’s strange to me that you think it’s perfectly okay for a 16-year-old minor to drive a car that could potentially get them killed if they got into a car accident.

          But you are not okay with 16-year-olds being able to legally vote because you are worry adults might bully them for their own beliefs and interests.

      • veee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        2 months ago

        I bring up life experience because most 16 year olds are starting to take a Civics class in high school and are balancing this out while discovering their own social identity. Do I think that young people, on average, make good decisions? Not necessarily, but I also think adults aren’t perfect decision makers either.

        I’ve since learned that political party members as young as 14 years old are allowed to vote in party leadership elections, so there is precedence in reducing the voting age minimum.

        If young people continue to show engagement in politics, however, I could see the conversation being taken more seriously and the voting age being reduced (to 16 or 17) before the end of the decade.

  • Vinny_93@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    11
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    edit-2
    2 months ago

    Europe votes in a couple of weeks. 16 year olds will have a vote for the first time.

    • TrenGoblinOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      2 months ago

      Wow that’s great I’m so happy that 16-year-olds will be able to legally be allowed to vote for the first time in Europe.

      • Vinny_93@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        2 months ago

        This reads like sarcasm. I think that if it turns out successful, it might set a precedent for other countries to follow.

  • Octospider@lemmy.one
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    2 months ago

    Canadians don’t even want proportional representation. Improving our democracy isn’t important. So, I can’t imagine they would support 16 year olds voting.

  • Gleddified
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    3
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    2 months ago

    Knowing myself and my high school at 16, I gotta disagree. I’m sure there are a good number of responsible 16yos out there, but there’s a lot more that don’t respect the gravity of what they’re doing.

    I would have absolutely voted for whoever was stupidest for the meme, as would many of my friends.

  • willya@lemmyf.uk
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    8
    arrow-down
    11
    ·
    2 months ago

    That shouldn’t be the age anywhere. If anything it needs to be raised.

    • DosDude👾@retrolemmy.com
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      13
      arrow-down
      7
      ·
      2 months ago

      Honestly, 16 year olds have a better view on what’s good for the planet than the average boomer. And I’m saying this as an older millennial.

      They have to live in this future, on average, longer. So why should it be raised?

      • FiveMacs
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        9
        arrow-down
        4
        ·
        2 months ago

        If anything the age should be lowered (in the sense that 60+ shouldn’t really be able to anymore). I picked that age at random

        • AmosBurton_ThatGuy
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          6
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          edit-2
          2 months ago

          Ya tbh once you hit retirement age or something you shouldn’t have a say anymore. Greedy old people that don’t care about future generations got us where we are today. Why should they control the future when they won’t even live long enough to face the consequences of their shitty actions/beliefs?

          • BCsven
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            2 months ago

            Not every retired pwrson is an old school “boomer”, some are very educated and have seen trends come and go to be wise about voting. i trust them more than a 16 year old who lives with parents aying their way …who’s biggest voting point might be irrelevant compared to larger picture of knowing how cost of living, bills and inter country politics work

            • AmosBurton_ThatGuy
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              3
              ·
              2 months ago

              Couldn’t care less. All old people going forward shouldn’t get a say including my generation when I reach that age. Old people are short sighted and stuck in their ways, incapable or unwilling to change.

              Fuck em all.

              • BCsven
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                edit-2
                2 months ago

                Sounds like you are stuck in your ways , incapable or unwilling to change. LOL. If you actually talked to old people, not just what you see about boomers amd corporate distopia you will find many are very open minded.

                As an anecdote, my mum is old and grew up in an era of racism and gay being illegal. she is now in public or on facebook having daily fights calling people out on the racism, and spreading acceptance for the lgbtq2s+ community. Intelligent people do chane their views, ageism has no bearing on that