You all might not be aware, but I think Rudd started this server only at the beginning of June for funsies, probably only expecting a couple of hundred users.
Then, of course, came Reddit API-calypse. Now, here we are barely 4 weeks later, almost 80k users on the instance. From nothing, to a respectable chuck of the fediverse, just that fast. Pretty amazing.
True, I opened my account June 1st on Beehaw, lemmy.world didn’t exist yet. But I had to open an account on LW when BH defederated them…
I’m happy to see .world growing for this reason. There has to be a neutral ground for everyone. The gatekeeping of communities like Beehaw are fine for them, but in order for the lemmy to grow, it has to be shapeable by the community. Moderation screening, content rigidity, and walled gardens are antithetical to the type of social network that people are looking for as a replacement to Reddit. The community has to be allowed to make the place its own.
Edit: For the record, I’m perfectly aware they plan to refederate once they get their “moderation” tools. I just question what tools they deem sufficient to permit refederation. Moderation tools on Lemmy will be extremely powerful thanks to votes being public, and I don’t trust admins of some of these instances to be responsible or fair with them, or to only use them on the most toxic elements. Petty, groundless shadowbanning and admin “curation” is going to plague Lemmy going forward, mark my words. That’s why we need some neutral ground.
I made an account on sh.itjust.works because world was having some issues registering new users. Because of this small issue I ended up taking a deep dive into learning about the Fediverse. It’s such a cool concept and really easy to use once you familiarize yourself with it.
It’s also awesome that instances can federate with one another, so communities can continue to grow! I was apprehensive of making the switch initially due to the presumption that it would require a steep learning curve, but I learned how to access, browse, and interact on lemmy in 15 minutes or less lol.
I keep mentioning it, but the fediverse reminds me of my early days of browsing reddit back in the mid-late 2000s. Lemmy feels like home and I can’t wait to see it grow :)
And it’s real good to see you here, if this is the original PK.
Yep, it’s really me! I made my first sourced comment the other day about Twitter and Elon Musk.
This just made my day, so glad poppin is here!
So glad you’re here! It feels like home now!
Okay I was a chronic lurker on Reddit but seeing you here gives me hope for the Soccer community on this site, which has thus far been a huge gaping hole. I honestly haven’t used anything other than r/Soccer to keep up with football news in many years so I hope Lemmy can shoulder that burden sooner rather than later. It’s probably the one part of Reddit that I’m really struggling to replace and/or live without.
Hey o/
Yea truth be told I still visit r/soccer and r/reddevils to catch up on football related news every morning/evening. The communities on Lemmy are still growing and while the more popular communities are very active, niche communities like sports will take some time.
Check out the football community on Lemmy, it’s starting to get active. I’ve recently started posting too.
I’m not sure how to link directly to a community, so here’s a link to one of my posts. You can click on the community and subscribe
gooble gobble one of us! Took me days of futility to finally get my account to activate. Sigh, F5 and re-captcha. But I finally found a window. It reminded of trying to buy bjork tickets back in the day.
Oh hi, that’s a name I never thought I’d see again, good to see you’re here
Hey cool, you run an electronic music community. I just subbed!
Absolutely agreed, I’m very grateful for world :3
Can you (or anyone else) explain the circumstances around them defederating? More specifically, why would they do that, and what exactly is their benefit?
My understanding for Beehaw specifically is that it was a temporary measure to guard against the huge influx of users, as well as a way to stop trolls from creating duplicate accounts from World (since it’s popular and has open registration). Defederating gives them time to figure some things out and scale up if they want to.
.world doesn’t require as stringent verification and beehaw mods claimed that a lot of spam was coming from .world. I don’t know if that’s true, but that’s what they claimed.
Someone dug into the mod logs and found four or five instances of lemmy.world accounts being moderated on Beehaw. That’s all it took for them to defederate
Beehaw will probably die if they want to defederate from any largr instance with open signups. This whole system won’t work without open signups because no one wants to go through an interview process to use a social media site. They’ll leave or just cave and go back to reddit.
Fully agree. Ain’t nobody wanna audition just to talk to people online.
Not sure why people care so much, they are only hurting themselves and the communities hosted on their insurance — way more than the damage to .ml or .world
The moderation tools available in Lemmy currently are a bit lacking so it put too much burden on Beehaw staff to moderate users from instances that allow fully open signup. Beehaw was seeing a large influx of trolls signing up on open signup instances and causing a lot of problems over there which eventually pushed the matter. For those unaware, Beehaw prides itself on keeping a tight lid on tolls and negativity so it was really against their ethos to not be able to keep up with it.
It’s worth noting that there is no hostility or anything between Beehaw and the other instance admins. Both sides admins have been openly posting about their discussions and both sides are looking forward to refederating as soon as the mod tools in Lemmy improve enough to do so.
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Make sure you throw him a dollar or two on patreon if you can. We don’t want this all to come crashing down around us or be loaded down by ads.
I was going to ask, is there a place where I can go in like pitch in some money or something to help with the server? I want to keep this place running and I want to do what I can to help
Ruud has a combined Patreon for lemmy.world and mastodon.world (he owns and maintains both). You can find that here: https://www.patreon.com/mastodonworld
I wish the only options weren’t to do a monthly subscription
https://opencollective.com/mastodonworld
It even takes less of a cut than Patreon too.
Thanks donated 5 euros…I’m part of the revolution. Fuck you spez 😂
Thanks for this! I tend to lurk more than post so it is nice to be able to contribute to the upkeep
Open collective allows for a one time donation: https://opencollective.com/mastodonworld
I pitched in 5 Euro. Credit union thought it was fishy lol
Thanks for the link! Came here looking for a way to help keep this place free (as in freedom) because I really want it to keep rolling :)
Done.
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On the main web page at lemmy.world on the right hand sidebar there are links for donating to lemmy.world and mastodon.world via patreon.
Kbin didn’t even exist a couple months ago. I can only imagine the pressure to get it polished and ready for the migration.
It’ll be very interesting to see how the scalability shakes out over the next several months and beyond and what sort of growing pains there end up being with a system like this growing, especially so quickly. I’m a new user here just regularly reminding myself to be patient when things aren’t always snappy.
For real? It was suggested by some people to me because it was the biggest; and that was the day of the API switch. To have only begun at the start of the month is wild.
Yeah, the growth of world, ml, beehaw, and Lemmy in general over the last month is pretty incredible. I’m on five instances. And they’ve all grown incredibly.
The timing sure as hell worked out!
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Guess I will make my first comment. Hi everyone :)
Hi!
Welcome.
This is my second post.
hello, this is my second post as well!
Hi there!
Hey there!
Hi! =)
Welcome in :)
Welcome!
Heyder
Keep in mind, dear folks, simply coming ain’t enough. Be sure to stay and visit often, otherwise the rich assholes win ;)
This is not a good thing. Part of the problem is third-party apps like Sync and other Fediverse advocates that direct Reddit users to sign up on only one instance, lemmy.world. This is understandable to keep things simple for the Redditors but it hurts lemmy.world (cost and performance-wise) and the Fediverse as a whole (centralization) to have a lot of accounts on one instance. I hope lemmy.world can make an announcement or guide to encourage users to spread out to more instances.
I think another reason too is that .world is run by Ruud who is a trusted actor in the space (he already runs Mastodon.world, a large mastodon instance), and so many (including me) probably felt it would be a safe harbor and not likely to get shut down or run poorly.
Maybe ony Lemmy.world’s registration page thay can list other instances that they trust and endorse.
Not a bad idea. Might need assistance vetting servers and admins right now though as Ruud is probably busy taking a fire extinguisher to the server room every other minute.
This is a brilliant idea. Drive all the traffic to lemmy.world as it seems like the “main hub”, then when registering drive users to a few other instances as well
Maybe we should set up a separate site that monitors different instances and tries to suggest instances in the federation group that you want and then everyone gets directed there.
I stumbled into lemmy disoriented and just went with lemmy.ca because I always want to support ‘local’ domains. I’m surprised people go for for something like ‘.world’ tbh. Although, I think your logic makes sense I also know how little people read and its safer to say people just signed up for the instance that was the path of least resistance (low application threshold, links guiding them in, etc)
I scrolled through a few that were recommended and world seemed like it was just generally the best fit for me. Especially since I didn’t want any chance of running into explicitly queerphobic communities while having plenty of variety in topics
I am waiting on my lemm.ee confirmation. Might daily drive it if it gets heavy here.
I did exactly the same!
It’s just that I really don’t care about what happens in my area within this context, I can just go outside to know what’s going on. And if I want to talk to local people I don’t do it on here either, so I prefer more international communities than just my town except it’s online
For anyone that’s using Lemmy.world and wants to lessen their burden on the admins, look for a Lemmy instance closer to you (in the physical world) using this site:
https://fediverse.observer/map
Sign up on that instance, sign in on your Lemmy app, sort based on All, and you should be able to see the same content as if you were on Lemmy.world!
Edit: the above map doesn’t show which instances are federated with each other (or aren’t). Quick Google searches seems to indicate that there is no way to see this, so it’s wise to keep your Lemmy.world account open along with your smaller Lemmy account to make sure you’re seeing the instances you want to see.
Me just now - Oh that’s a good idea! (Looks up the instances near me and sees the names) Oh, that’s right. I live in conservative hell. :(
I’ll go a little further and find a less crazy instance…
Looks at location-based fediverse list.
Looks outside window.
Yeah, that tracks.
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I only have Mastodon instances near me. Can Mastodon instances browse Lemmy instances?
I believe Mastodon is a different software compared to Lemmy. Lemmy is an aggregation software of the entire Fediverse, while Mastodon is more like Twitter. My limited knowledge of Mastodon makes me think that it wouldn’t be possible to see Lemmy instances, but if you sent your comment using Mastodon then there might be a chance. Hopefully someone else in the comments will sound off.
You can see posts and users on Lemmy instances from Mastodon. However there are some limitations.
It would be helpful if they would allow you to filter by which instances allow sign ups. Unless I’m just not seeing it.
There’s a ‘Signups’ column in the list view.
I tried lemmy.world, it seemed to slow. So I signed up to lemmy.nz… much quicker and more relevant to me.
Kia ora, Greetings from another lemmy.nz user!
And another! It’s nice having our own little corner of the world
I think we’re trusting them to crunch the numbers and simply shut off registration if it gets out of control. At least, I’d hope so.
That wouldn’t be good either if third parties are still funnelling new users to lemmy.world. They’ll see a “sign ups closed” message, assume there is only one forum and it’s closed, then go back to Reddit.
Actually it’s even worse than that. I tried yesterday to register on https://lemmy.ml but it let me go through the registration process up to the submit button before returning an error message “Registration Closed”.
- It’s very annoying to have closed registration in the first place.
- When registration is closed the registration form should definitely not be present and let me fill the whole form.
- The error message should not just say “Registration Closed”, there should be some indication of where else I should go to register.
This is good feedback! If you haven’t already, you might post it to [email protected]. They may have already gotten this feedback, so you might do a quick skim of other posts before doing so, but honestly it’d be good to post just with this point specifically, since others may have only tossed it in amidst more general feedback.
A necessary evil but one that can be overcome. I would hope there’d be a way to leave a message about trying one of many other instances or at least a link to a Fediverse FAQ.
Some degree of centralization is inevitable. I think it may be 2-4 main instances that people will predominately use.
I think the best approach might be general subject-specific instances? Like, video.games with a main games community, meme community, then smaller communities for various games - or sports.social, with communities for each sport.
I feel like we’re going to end up with a particular community on a particular instance ending up as the “default” community for that subject, but it’d probably be better (in an ideal world) to have those on separate instances to maintain some degree of decentralization
If a community goes to shit due to power tripping mods you can just switch instances too.
I know that it’s inevitable, but the signup flow should try to weaken that effect instead of contribute to it. An example of how not to do it is Mastodon’s old homepage which led to only one instance, mastodon.social, to “make onboarding easier”.
Hi, I’m new here. How can I move to another instance? Is there a way to migrate, or do I just have to register another account somewhere else? Thanks :)
I’m new, but slightly less so, and haven’t yet found a way to migrate my account to a new instance. But it’s also fairly trivial to just create a new account on another instance, especially when you don’t yet have a ton of subscriptions or much of a reply history to lose. Lemmy doesn’t have a running karma like reddit did, so it’s not like you’re even losing fake internet points in the process.
I think there was word that they were going to add that functionality at some point.
I don’t think you can migrate, since if that was possible your “karma” would also be able to move with you. People have been asking for that recently, but others have been saying that the Lemmy software doesn’t support that.
I think the best thing you can do is make a new account on a new instance and look back at the rest of the fediverse from that instance.
I gotta give it to this instance tho. Right now it has the fastest loading time ive ever experienced on the internet in a long time. Dont browse too fast tho, or you might get rate limited.
How is it possible to decentralise sign ups and see/searchable content and tabs? I used to be tech savvy but these days I struggle a bit. Turning into a dinosaur.
I have a “when I stop being bad at web development” project idea for this, hopefully someone who has a development background can pick it up.
The idea is an open-source onboarding portal that takes all Lemmy instances from awesome-lemmy-instances and Kbin instances from FediDB and lets their admins tag their instances with what the instance is focused on, maybe through a dedicated community or something. This list of instances and tags is public so instances can’t cheat the system with fake tags or get secretly blacklisted just because the project maintainer disagrees with them.
Users get directed to the portal and fill out a quiz with questions like “what are your hobbies”, “do you prefer strict or lax moderation”, and get matched to a list of the closest servers and recommended communities. There will also be a simple load balancing algorithm to make large instances less likely to be recommended. Of course, because it’s open source, the algorithm and list of instances can be changed if someone wants to host their own portal.
Basically, something like Spread Mastodon that covers the entire known network and not just a few of the largest instances that are approved by mastodon.social.
I like the idea and it sounds like a fantastic tool for people who would have been interested in the Fediverse anyway. I just fear taking a quiz is too cumbersome to be an optimal onboarding method for Lemmy as a Reddit replacement. The reason .world exploded in popularity was the simplicity (just go here and sign up and you’re posting within minutes and your Local is the biggest instance so you’re going to find content even if you’ve not discovered the All button).
Doesn’t every major social media website have an onboarding quiz these days? Whenever I created an alt on Reddit or Twitter, there would be this prompt asking me what I’m interested in, then it would recommend subreddits/accounts/hashtags to follow. I know Facebook and Instagram prompt for your contacts and interests to generate recommendations too. If the average social media user can manage this, so can future Threadiverse users.
Find instances on https://join-lemmy.org
Find subs (communities) on https://browse.feddit.de
These are great suggestions, but for finding communities, I would recommend https://lemmyverse.net/communities instead.
The Interface is nicer, you can directly get the [email protected] string for searching it locally, and it doesn’t use a large blocklist like feddit.de sadly does.
At least, users of lemmy.world (and from different servers when we are at it) should be educated, so they feel relatively confident to switch and understand why this is important.
Why not have a central hub though? I’d much prefer communities with higher populations
I have tried many forum-styled site over the years including the politically more questionable ones, and from what I see theres 3 hurdles a site need to pass in order to be good:
-
it needs good infrastructure, especially user interface (where 4ch, most forum, and now reddit fail)
-
it has some gatekeeping to filter out the “order consumers”, but not too much that it drives user away, including having a toxic environment (where 4ch and .win fail)
-
it needs to have enough user generated content so thay theres actually reasons to use the site (whre most reddit clones fail)
from what I see lemmy has passed all the hurdles, and I have good hope the fediverse will stick around
What is an order consumer
In a community, whether if it’s online or your local club or just society in general, it requires admin/moderator/judges/law enforcement etc. to put in hard work to create rules and order so everything function smoothly. In a sense, the “order” they create here can be treated as a commodity.
A user can do things that helps out the moderators and create order (e.g. taxes, volunteering), or break rules and cause chaos, which “consumes” order (e.g. criminal activity, riots, trolling etc.) . Order consumers refers to people who consumes more order than they create.
E: typo
It seems like an odd term for what you’re describing. Shouldn’t it be something like “Civic Detractors” or “Chaos Agents”?
“Fucker”
Quite similar, I use “order consumer” as you can apply a lot of concepts from finance and economy for a regular consumer, it also makes a bit more sense consider someone can both consumes and create order, e.g. they pay their taxes (creates order) but also litter (consumes order), and its only a problem when you consume more than you create
I’d call it a disruptor, but Chaos Agent is also good.
I’d use the term “antisocial”.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/antisocial
hostile or harmful to organized society especially : being or marked by behavior deviating sharply from the social norm
I really appreciate learning this term, thanks
What is .win fail?
Where the_donald migrates to after they left reddit
-
I just really hope the engagement continues and grows.
I’m pretty sure I’ve commented more within the last 2 days than my 8 years on Reddit lol. Engagement is definitely higher
Yeah same. When the network errors level out it will be better as well. For example anytime I comment I see an error but it actually posts.
I’m guessing you’re on lemmy.world? I’m on a smaller instance so I don’t get any of those errors
Yup. Hopefully it gets resolved soon, I don’t want to resubscribe to everything from another instance.
@[email protected] made a script for it: https://github.com/wescode/lemmy_migrate
Nice, that is perfect
Same here on world…
Curious, what app or client are you using?
wefwef.app, mostly to lemmy.world
Mlem and Memmy but having so many issues with comments and posting
Me too. Has more of a small town feel. Usually, because I’m in Australia, my comments are buried and never get replied to because the US is sleeping. Here, people are actually engaging. Loving it so far.
Wish the sorting worked a little better in wefwef so I’m not scrolling past the same posts each time, but otherwise feels like the reddit I joined 16 years ago (or slightly thereafter when comments were added)
I was wondering about this on WefWef. Is scrolling by the same posts a few times a sorting problem or a “there hasn’t been any new posts yet” problem?
I’m pretty sure it’s related to how the default sorting algorithm works, the default sort typically being Active. If the description in the docs is still accurate, I think maybe there’s something a little off in the decay time*, making it so posts linger, people keep commenting & conversing in comments, which keeps posts propped up, until finally at some point activity subsides enough for it to allow other posts to show up.
*-(possibly taking too long to take effect or not being weighted heavily enough?)
Most of the reddit apps I’ve tried have a “hide seen” function that I feel like wefwef could really benefit from
I saw that function posted elsewhere, but I assume it’s from a desktop interface because I can’t see it in the app
I use the filter options, especially Top Day, to get newer content. Also make sure it’s not set to just local content too.
Desktop or mobile browser, yes. In your account settings there’s an option to “Show read posts”. Uncheck it and you shouldn’t see posts you’ve voted on on your front page anymore.
Lol same here. I’ve actively upvoted and commented more then I’ve ever had. I really want this place to work and trying to be the change I wanna see
What kinds of posts do you comment on? I’m finding it a bit difficult to find always active communities and discussions, which is the only thing preventing me from commenting as much as I used to with Apollo. Things like tipofmytongue, cringe, IsitBullshit, and outoftheloop along with movie and tv discussions were my frequent haunts, particularly when I can’t sleep at night, but sadly I’m not finding the same amount of engagement here. Hopefully as we grow we can find that same level of engagement.
Reddit had so many users that hyper specialisation was possible.
There was a subreddit for every tv show. And people are coming here expecting the same. I think we’ll see similar content but a bit less niche.
For instance instead of a community for every tv show it might be better to just post about any tv show in /c/television
I used to follow /r/pizza but I’ve seen tons of home made pizza photos in /c/foodporn
For most niche topics you can probably think of a more general community which will help drive content and critical mass.
Only way to grow these communities with niche topics is to interact with them yourself. If you want c/pizza to grow, post content and interact in it!
I only ever posted like 3 times in the last 10 years on Reddit, but I realized that in order to see this community grow I’ll probably have to step up and start posting stuff too like what others have been doing for me.
I’m just going on r/all (idk what the Lemmy term is called) and sort by new. Whatever I see that interests me, like news about the world or a photo I find looks good. For now I’m just talking in whatever I find because I want to increase engagement overall. Later, when my niche communities become big enough to the point I don’t need to constantly talk, I’ll probably relax on my engagement.
Yep, same approach I’m taking.
For now browsing all is a good starting point. If I come across an interesting community while doing that, then I’ll add it to my subscriptions.
As things grow, I’ll switch more to browsing my subscribed communities.
I gotta permabanned a few months ago from r tip of my tongue because I gave an answer that the OP eventually edited into their comment to say “no” to. Fuck whichever mod did that. I really hope we get a good version or ten or that community here. I really enjoyed it back in the day. Something changed in the last couple years.
Another “same” from me. I’m really trying to not lurk as much as I did on Reddit. Every bit of engagement helps.
Same. I mostly lurked on Reddit. I’ve been way more engaged here.
Same. I mostly lurked on Reddit. I’ve been way more engaged here.
Lol same here. I’ve actively upvoted and commented more then I’ve ever had. I really want this place to work and trying to be the change I wanna see
I just see no reason to go back to reddit so at least you’re stuck with me
No take backs :)
I’m seeing some very encouraging signs here. There’s a lot of discussion about the platform itself on the platform (I’m looking at you Ham Radio nuts talking about talking on the radio…) but there’s a fair chunk of people discussing links and topics of interest, the thing it needs most to survive. In other words, people are actually using it for its intended purpose and seeing some success in doing so.
The technical issues are actively being solved as the platform explodes in size practically overnight.
As for that ineffable quality of how the community feels? That has yet to be determined. The bots are on the way, and it’s up to humans to choose how they will conduct themselves in the face of hostile bots and astroturfers who wish to sow discord.
The level of overall 'civic engagement ’ on Lemmy has been pretty great.
Lemmy perfectly represents the adage “building the plane as you fly it” and it’s been so much fun seeing it take shape.
I suppose this is a good place for my first post. I’m happy to be here. This has saved me from the withdrawals of losing reddit. I hope we can make this an active community.
Glad to have you, bag of buttholes!
/r/rimjobsteve wait…
As a refugee myself, it’s amazing to see the growth. In just the four days I’ve been here, there’s been sensuous growth seen.
I dunno if we want to see sensuous growth…
Omg…. What a typo! I’m leaving it.
I think we might…
There are NSFW instances for that
How did you do italics by the way?
it’s just like reddit: put the text in between a pair of asterisks to get sexy italics 😉
sweet!
Does bold work too?
Yes, two asterisks
awesome!
cross outItalics
Bold
Normal^(superscript)
#header 1?
Code block PleaseJust testing if the markdown is exactly the same or if I need to relearn
Edit:
Hmm, superscript will be one I need to figure out
header 1 attempt 2
Very reminiscent of the moment/ jump to reddit from digg.
Really interested to hear about the plans and costs to scale up and grow in a stable, reliable, and safe way. Hopefully Patreon membership grows too and allows continued performance improvements.
I think for more casual users, continued degraded performance - or worse, an instance being stopped for whatever reason and the content and accounts being lost - would probably stop the platform being a true replacement. Casual users would head back to Reddit.
I think having a public roadmap and backlog, good communication and transparency will be super important, particularly in these early stages.
Great job so far, this kind of sudden growth is not easy to manage!
I’m hopeful it could be a fresh start like before reddit was really popular and there were a lot more discussions being surfaced to all page over reposts.
It was how I would find new subs and rabbit holes.
I wonder to what extent causal users contribute to the health of the platform. May depend on how “casual” they are, but it may be possible that their absence won’t be that detrimental.
Love the decentralized model. I’m so over corporate run sites looking to make a profit
Honestly, I also try to be more active as a user in Lemmy, and it feels way more rewarding because it feels like a more tight-knitly community here. Like it a lot!
Not too long ago I was worried that this place may get deserted after a first boost, but it is awesome to see that more and more people are coming. So glad this is happening and it already feels like a really good alternative to Reddit!
I think we will probably continue to see the numbers growing. When moving over, looking for an active instance was important. Lemmy.World definitely stood out over most for me, which is why I registered here.
Always have hope! I don’t think Lemmy will die at all in the near couple months, but it will be a test of time.
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Well I’m a refugee and I’m here to stay. Sucks to be you.
For reference point:
On July first 1 am, we had 62k people.
As of right now, we’re at 75k
80k
And on June ~10th we first got 2k people. This growth is equal parts insane and inspiring.
The most impressive thing is that ruud has kept up with the growth and this instance is still running.
I’m very excited to see how this all develops. Right now it’s pretty rough and the constant failure to load/comments getting duplicated or disappearing hurts a lot but it does have potential. Let the Lemmy’s free!
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That’s understandable, I think my (and many other refugee adopters) are just trying to figure out how the fediverse works and how instances communicate with each other. If I have a .world account I can pull threads from the other Lemmy servers, can I cross the streams into something like Mastodon too?
Yes, you can view and interact with mastadon and knin accounts though lemmy. tho something like kbin integrates better with lemmy because their interfaces are pretty similar. I think as development continues we will see better tools for different areas of the fediverse to better interact with eachother.
Let the Lemmy’s free!
I believe “Lemmings” is the preferred nomenclature :P
I’d rather not be called a lemming tbh. Especially during these times online
