Ottawa has started to make payments for key components for 14 additional U.S.-built F-35s, even as the Carney government has been reviewing future fighter-jet purchases in the context of trade tensions with Washington, sources have told CBC News.

The money for these 14 aircraft is in addition to the contract for a first order of 16 F-35s, which will start being delivered to the Canadian Armed Forces at the end of the year.

According to sources, the new expenses are related to the purchase of so-called “long-lead items,” which are parts that must be ordered well in advance of the delivery of a fully assembled aircraft.

Canada had to make these expenditures to maintain its place in the long-term delivery schedule and avoid being replaced by other buyers in the queue, sources said.

  • TheObviousSolution
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    2 days ago

    It wouldn’t even have to be that. There’s enough specialized US data communication and GPS microchips in there that any one of them could be compromised. There’s more than enough history of this, people not willing to consider it are part of a bubble: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardware_backdoor#History

    “The ‘kill switch’ in the F-35 is more than just a rumour,” Joachim Schranzhofer, the head of communications at German defense company Hensoldt informed the local media outlet Bild. “But it’s much easier to use the mission planning system - then the plane stays on the ground.”

    I’ll take the word of the head of communication at a German defense company that has actually vetted the systems over armchair commenters any day.

    Then there’s the possibility of backdoors to access mission critical data by deliberately compromising their encryption: https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/a-brief-history-of-the-nsa-attempting-to-insert-backdoors-into-encrypted-data

    Then there’s the chasm between “complete technical schematics” being available and actually being able to produce said equipment without resorting to a US controlled supply line. It’s not just firmware, if they cut off access to maintenance supplies, you aren’t going to have it easier than Russia is having it with their sanctions, it’s still going to take its toll on your supply line.

    • Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
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      2 days ago

      Joachim Schranzhofer, the head of communications at German defense company Hensoldt informed the local media outlet Bild

      Here’s the source that previous poster failed to include for this part: https://militarywatchmagazine.com/article/german-policymakers-concerned-american-kill-switch-disable-f35

      That article is largely a pile of meaningless sensationalism with very little in the way of meaningful claims. All of it more or less boils down to this;

      with analysts specifically observing that the Autonomic Logistics Information System (ALIS) system which is heavily centralised in the United States could easily be used to disable the fighters.

      This is a claim that’s been repeated a bunch in the armchair general circuit, but without any of the actual context, and mangled beyond recognition from what the original sources say. ALIS cannot “ground” a plane in the sense of “Prevent it from taking off at the press of a button.” It’s a logistics management system. All it does is track parts orders. The US could shut people out of it, which would be a massive pain in the ass, but it wouldn’t actually prevent planes from flying.

      Here’s a source that actually digs into a little better: https://www.defensenews.com/air/2016/04/27/could-connectivity-failure-ground-f-35-it-s-complicated/

      First, some context (from the article) on what ALIS actually is:

      ALIS, often called the backbone of the F-35 fleet, is an information technology hub that is used to plan missions, track aircraft status, order spare parts, and manage sustainment of the plane. By contrast, legacy aircraft use several standalone systems to perform these daily functions. ALIS is the first system of its kind to manage daily squadron operations, track sustainment trends and protect sovereign information — all in one hub, according to Dave Scott, vice president of training and logistics solution business development for Lockheed Martin Mission Systems and Training.

      When the previous poster’s quote source talks about the mission planning system, this is what they’re referring to (I’m going to skip right past their assertion that the kill switch “is more than just a rumour” because the article presents this claim with absolutely zero evidence, context, or expansion; it’s just thrown out there and treated as gospel truth. Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence).

      Anyway, from the article I cited;

      Losing connectivity to ALIS would be a pain, but hardly fatal, the JPO contends. If jets are unable to use ALIS — a ground-based system that provides sustainment and support, but not combat capabilities for the jet — the F-35 is still a usable plane. In fact, the worst case scenario would be that operators would have to track maintenance and manage daily squadron operations manually, just as older jets do.

      Emphasis mine. ALIS cannot “ground” planes, it can only make it harder to maintain them. And only to the extent that it’s already hard to maintain existing planes like our CF-18s. This is a solved problem. We know how to do this. It’s not a magic kill switch, it can’t shut anything off. It’s just an inventory management system.

      • patatas@sh.itjust.works
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        2 days ago

        You claim this is a “ground-based system”, but that is not true according to this description:

        “the Autonomic Logistics Information System (ALIS) … is a router designed to fit inside of an F-35’s travel pod that has the capability to connect to a hardline network or satellite internet, which allows them to transmit the F-35’s data simultaneously to many remote bands and regions”

        https://www.dvidshub.net/image/7342014/autonomic-logistics-information-system

        So while the analysis of the data happens on the ground, ALIS is also very much inside the plane and monitors its systems in real-time:

        “ALIS receives Health Reporting Codes while the F-35 is still in flight”

        https://www.lockheedmartin.com/content/dam/lockheed-martin/rms/documents/alis/CS00086-55 (ALIS Product Card).pdf

        Yet you claim “all it does is track parts orders.”

        Care to explain why you have omitted these basic facts while defending Canada’s purchase of the F-35s?

        • Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
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          2 days ago

          Ground based. This doesn’t exclude it having components onboard the aircraft.

          And yes, fundamentally, tracking inventory and maintenance requirements is all it does. I apologize if I oversimplified the details a little too much, but I’m trying to keep things readable and not get bogged down in details, and it wasn’t relevant to my point. And if you’d thought about it a little longer you’d quickly realise that it’s not relevant to whatever point you seem to be trying to make either.

          ALIS includes a component that is carried aboard the plane and provides telemetry. Fact freely granted.

          And entirely irrelevant to the notion I was addressing. The fact that ALIS transmits information from the craft is not germane to the point that it cannot be used to affect the operability of the craft - and that’s according to the people who actually use and maintain these systems. I’m not making these claims; the experts are.

          But none of that occurred to you because you are so desperate to try to find some kind of conspiracy theory here. To the point where even bothering to write this reply is pointless, because I can only assume that you’ve decided that I’m some kind of deep cover CIA agent here on direct orders from Steven Miller.

          It is fucking exhausting talking to you people. I genuinely cannot comprehend the insane degree to which any tangential detail gets fantasized and catastrophized into an elaborate work of Tom Clancy fan fiction.

          • patatas@sh.itjust.works
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            1 day ago

            “You people”

            Hey look, I never made any claims other than pointing out that you were clearly intentionally being misleading.

            Anyway: would you fly a plane if you could not verify that it was in working order?